Episode 147: Interview with Radford Head Coach Alex Guerra

[00:00:02] Speaker A: Hey, parents and coaches, are your kids using the right glove? The most important skill for youth athletes to learn is how to play proper catch. The problem is most youth gloves are made with bad leather and are too big for small hands. They actually make it harder to play catch. That's why former Major League Baseball shortstop Kevin Smith created Cali Gloves. Cali gloves are crafted from 100% Japanese kip leather and are the perfect size for kids. All Cali gloves come with palm slits, finger loops and elastic wrist lacing that encourage proper hand placement. The right closing patterns and give kids more confidence to go make plays. Cali gloves even allow parents to break in the glove without stretching out the fit. It's the glove Kevin wishes he had growing up and the glove all his teammates want for their kids. Visit caligloves.com to learn more and help your kids play better catch. Cali Gloves K a l I gloves.com. [00:01:12] Speaker B: Welcome to this week's edition of the Dugout Dish podcast. I'm Andy Kirakidis, joined by my Wonderful co host, Mr. Keith Glasser. How are we doing? [00:01:20] Speaker A: Great. How are you? [00:01:21] Speaker B: Good. We got a guest on today, somebody that I had the pleasure of spending many a days on the road with. Competed against him while he was in a couple different uniforms. Somebody I'm pretty excited to have on the podcast. But I'll kick it over to you Keith for the intro. [00:01:36] Speaker A: Sure. Tonight we are joined by a long time longtime friend, first time guest, he's in his fourth year as a head coach at his alma mater. Tonight we're joined by Alex Guerra, the head baseball coach at Radford University. Alex, AG thanks for coming on babe. [00:01:56] Speaker C: Thanks for having me guys. It's great to see your faces. Great to catch up with you. I'm excited about it. [00:02:02] Speaker A: Yeah, it's wonderful. We just had, we were on our pre show, we were talking about we, we all played for the same guy, Coach Rakuya, who actually we interviewed a couple weeks ago. So a lot of small, small world, this baseball world where you end up making a lot of friends through, through people that you played for, people you know. And I'm super happy and grateful that you're able to join us tonight. But before we get going, just give the listeners a quick rundown of how you got to be the head ball coach at Radford. [00:02:32] Speaker C: Yeah, absolutely. I appreciate you guys having, having me on. I think that this is one of one of the many tools that so many families can, can dive into and learn more about the recruiting process and just more, learn more about college baseball, which is a game that we all know is continuing to grow at a, at an extremely fast rate. So the more information that everybody has, it's only going to benefit them and you know, their, their kids future. And you guys are doing a great job and appreciate you guys having, having me on. But now I started at, started my career ucf. I played a Radford and once I was done, I was able to have the opportunity through Coach Recoya to go down to start my coaching career at Central Florida. Spent two great years there, had a chance to be a part of a regional team. My first year, you know, I show up and I didn't really understand what I was getting myself into. And Joe kind of alluded to that was like, man, you're, you're going to a program that can, it's going to really win and it's got really good players, really good coaches. So you've kind of hit the jackpot here. So had the opportunity to, to go down there with Coach Rooney and, and his staff for, for those two years. First year out, we won 43 games. Went to regional final against Stony Brook. That was when they had to beat us twice and they ended up having their magical run. And after, after ucf, I was able to come back to Radford as an assistant for two years as a recruiting coordinator and was a part of two of the most successful years in this program's history. 45 games in 2015, won the regular season, won a Big south championship and went to regional final against Vanderbilt. And then after those two years, spent the next six at James Madison. Six great years there with Coach Ike and then four years ago had an opportunity to come back and serve this university as his head coach and really dream come true. I mean there's not many coaches that have the opportunity to, you know, coach at the alma mater and it's. These jobs are hard, right? Just being a head coach in general in college and you know, you have the opportunity to come back to the place that you played at and I was assistant AD is, you know, I was very fortunate and very blessed with this opportunity and one that obviously I couldn't pass up. So going into year four now it feels like. I can't believe I, I'm saying year four, right? It's, it seems like yesterday it was my first day here, but we're in a really good, really good spot and got great assistant coaches, got great players and excited about this year coming up. [00:05:26] Speaker B: It seems like. It seems like yesterday I was running into you at Every field in Virginia or every field down in Georgia. Because when I was at William and Mary, you were at Radford for two years, and then at jmu, and it was just like, oh, there's ag. Might be at the right place then. That's exactly how I felt. [00:05:45] Speaker C: I think there's a lot of. A lot of our coaches in the state. I think you kind of feel the same way, right? Like, when we show up the game and Kurt's there from Virginia Tech, you're like, all right, I'm probably at the right spot. I feel pretty good about where I'm at. And I always felt that way about. About you. [00:06:01] Speaker B: I was just taking orders from Case. [00:06:02] Speaker A: So. [00:06:05] Speaker B: This is where you're going today. All right, sign me up. I'll have a report ready for you in the morning. [00:06:11] Speaker C: He ran a tight, man. You guys won. You guys won. I saw Case last summer. [00:06:17] Speaker B: He's the best man. I ran up to him this summer as well. I always try to. To make a point with him being up at the Coast Guard and. Good, good, good friend. We had him on the podcast, but just. Just an awesome dude. I learned a ton coaching with him. [00:06:32] Speaker C: I think our state and I've been in the state. Now this is. Shoot, the 13th year between being an assistant head coach. I think our state has some of the best baseball people I know. Glasses, probably thinking, like, easy, outsider right now. Obviously, it doesn't. Doesn't change how we feel about you. [00:06:55] Speaker B: Keith, but. [00:06:58] Speaker C: I think our state has so many great assistants and so many great coaches that are just good people. And obviously, you're one of those guys. It was a shame when you. When you got out of it. I think our. Our game lost a really good coach, but, you know, unfortunately, college athletics forces professionals to make decisions that, you know, they've got to make for the betterment of the, you know, their family. And what'd you. You left. And would you get a master's from William Mary? [00:07:29] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:07:29] Speaker C: Yeah. So you're way too smart for this college. [00:07:32] Speaker A: He's got two masters. [00:07:34] Speaker C: You know what I mean? Business school. [00:07:38] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:07:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:07:39] Speaker C: How'd you get two? [00:07:40] Speaker A: He's got more degrees himself than probably you and I have. [00:07:44] Speaker C: Well, I have one, so. [00:07:45] Speaker A: Yeah, so do I. He has. He has like, four. You and I have two together. [00:07:49] Speaker C: Oh, God. Yes. [00:07:50] Speaker A: Unbelievable. [00:07:51] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm not as dumb as I sound sometimes. I think my wife would argue. My wife would argue the opposite, but I think everybody. That's neither here nor there. [00:08:02] Speaker C: Yes, that'd be correct. [00:08:05] Speaker B: No, I mean, the. I Think about back, about the guys that, like, we used to just routinely run across, like Coach Stifler, head guy, Notre Dame. Now, I had some awesome chats with him back in the day when he had no business talking to me, didn't need to. But guys like him, you know, you got Mike Marin at Old Dominion, who's just a fantastic dude. You guys at Radford, you know, Kurt was running around at vcu, the guys. [00:08:34] Speaker C: At vmi, Sam Roberts does well. And like. [00:08:37] Speaker B: Yep, yep. And then. Shoot, what's his name? I'm drawing a blank on him right now. But he's the hidden coach for the Yankees. [00:08:45] Speaker C: Casey Dykes. [00:08:46] Speaker B: Yeah, Casey. Casey used to run around with. He used to run into games with him all the time. Like in. [00:08:51] Speaker C: About Justin Wellard. [00:08:52] Speaker B: Yep, Justin. [00:08:53] Speaker C: Yeah, he's a. He's a pitching coach for the Mets now. [00:08:56] Speaker B: Yep. And I caught the back end of Jeff Palumbo at vcu, I think. Or he might have just been up in the state a bunch of ecu, because they were everywhere. But, yeah, you run across these different coaches, and you learn so much just sitting there watching a game with them. Like, you know, we were both. I mean, you're still young. Like, I was young as an assistant there. And, like, you're sitting down with these guys who've won. I mean, stiff had won God knows how many games at vcu, and that guy's taking the time to sit there and talk to me about baseball. Like, you learn so much just being around those type of people. And it's interesting how so many of them are willing to give you information. Right? For sure. They don't hold this stuff close to their vest. Like. No, they. They're willing to have conversations and let you pick their brain on stuff. And, you know, I think that I felt lucky with the guys that we come across and the guys we had opportunity to. To be around. Rob Woodard was another one. He was attacked. We used to run into him all the time. You know, so it's. Yeah, that coaching network and, I mean, me and Keith talk about it all the time. Like, you learn so much from the other people. You know, you were talking about the little lady from Temple who'd been there for 50 years. And I brought up Coach Rossi. Yeah. Why wouldn't you listen to some of these guys? They've learned so much. And I know you still lean on a lot of these guys. Joe in particular. I know Joe's around all the time. Like, it's. It's how you get better. It's how you continue to evolve. [00:10:18] Speaker C: And I, I think coaching is a copycat profession. Right? I mean you, you have to drop your ego. You have to be willing to continue to learn, especially in today's landscape of, of college athletics. Just recruiting, evaluating, you know, the events that you go to, the background that you do on players. You know, we're, we're constantly growing and we're constantly evolving and then it goes into the way that you're coaching players. I mean, I think about, you know, I was a hitting coach for over a decade and this stuff that I talked about the first two years versus my last two years, like in your style and, and your teaching methods and the drills that you do and just completely have evolved and changed and you've got to be able to stay with the times 100 otherwise you're going to get left behind and you can't be again. I think it starts with your, your ego. You got to be able to drop it and understand that like there's other people that are doing really good things and if you can take some stuff that you feel like will work within the system and, and the routines and, and the way you go about your, your day to day, then it's going to help guys get better and it's going to help you win. Yeah, but it's, it's constantly growing. [00:11:48] Speaker B: Yeah, well, and you got all this influx, all the data and everything, which it sounds crazy to think but you know, eight years ago, all the stuff that we have access to that you guys have access to with True Media and Kinetrax and Trackman and like that wasn't there. And it's, it's like another point of evolution. Like you need to be up to speed on that stuff. And actually Joe talked about that on the podcast. Like, how do you merge these two worlds? Right? Like you were talking earlier before we got on here about how you value some of the old school stuff because you think it's really important for culture. Right? That's college baseball has a place for that 100. Because playing hard in the details like that never really goes away. Right. But then there's this whole development cycle with all the data driven stuff and yeah, you got to know what you're, you got to know what you're talking about. You gotta at least know how to implement it. And you know as well as anybody, like there's guys out there who are really, really good at it and to not seek them out to better understand, like, hey, how do I marry up this information? Like, how do you guys look at the data that you get. [00:12:53] Speaker C: Yeah, 100. Like we were talking about earlier with the scouting reports, that story you were telling offline, that never happens now. Like, will never not know what a guy's velo is going into a game. And there's been. You don't have to email a coach and say, hey, can you send us your report? And then you're taking it and you're blending it into the language that you want. Like, there's, there's no. I haven't asked a team for a report in probably five, six years. There's no need for it now. If someone ask us for a report, you're like, it's almost like going up to somebody in high school and asking them for their homework, and they've spent like two hours on their homework. It's like, no, I'm not giving you my homework. I spent two hours doing that. Doing all that. Well, we spent an entire week preparing for weekend series. Like, and then on Monday, like, someone's going to email me and ask me for my report. Like, no, do it yourself. You got synergy. You've got true media. You. Can you figure it out? [00:13:53] Speaker B: Yeah, it's evolved. [00:13:56] Speaker C: Yeah, it's totally evolved. And I think the information is good. I think, I think it's made our game better. I think it's helped developing players better. I think it's helped you make better decisions, whether it be recruiting, you make better decisions, whether it be putting a guy in a lineup or whatever his development plan is, because you've got information to back it up. Coaching doesn't change. Like, the communication, the relationship, the way that you motivate players, like, that will never change because that's. You can't put a price tag on a coach impacting another human being. You just, you can't. But the way. But your process and the way you go about it, that is going to constantly evolve with the amount of information that's. That's out there and in place. It's just a matter of, as a coach, like, what do you value is important to you and how you feel like some of those new, new wave of. Of information is going to be able to help these guys get better and what you want to take from it and what you think is. Is bs and that's. That's your job to be able to evaluate that. [00:15:14] Speaker B: Do you find in today's world where a lot of these kids are coming up with a lot of this information in front of them, whether they're working at a hitting facility or pitching facility, that, because I think there's two kind of trains of thought that people can take is like that sometimes the data can make it really messy because you get a kid who comes in and he's super fixated on like very specific things. But do you think that these kids are a lot more prepared to have those conversations and it's a, it's a really good leverage point. Or do you find sometimes you get guys that get caught too much in the data and aren't really looking at the gameplay stuff? I think. Does that look like from development? [00:15:49] Speaker C: Yeah, I think it's both 100. I look at some of this stuff as like in order for you to master high school, a high school subject, well, you've got to get through middle school, you got to get through your, the elementary piece of it, right? It's like you cannot be teaching an elementary school kid algebra 2. Like he's got to get the basic arithmetic down. So like if you're doing, if you're talking about data and any type of analytical information or a mechanical thought before that they can even hold the bat properly, well, you're, you're doing the kid a disservice. I think that when these kids are young, like the basics and the basic fundamentals have to be mastered. They have to be mastered in order for you to be able to take on those higher level development type of ideas that are going to involve data, that are going to involve higher level level type drills. Like if it, if a kick handed off the tee. Like you shouldn't be talking about the machine and what your trackman data is. There's, there's no need for that. I think there's a time and place for it. And then you got the kids that are so, they're so entrenched with the data piece that they lose sight and they lose focus of the ability to make in game adjustments. And as a coach, like you've got to be able to balance. Like what does that environment look like? You know, like for us, like when you're in the cage, it's before practice, like you want to work on your swing, you want to make mechanical adjustments, that's fine. But once we get to team practice and we're doing team stuff, like all that stuff goes out the window when we're in team, like we're, we're trying to win, we're focused on winning, we're focused on competing, we're focused on creating an environment that is, that is challenging. The tempo is important, the pace is important, the difficulty level is Important. I think there's a time and place for both of those things. You need to have an environment where you're, you're refining your mechanics, you're refining your movements, you're really getting, you're really slowing things down. And then there's, there's a time where you need to be able to turn the dial up. And we're focusing on creating an offense that's going to be able to translate to beating a guy on Friday night. [00:18:45] Speaker B: It's, it's such a transition for high school kids. Like you hit on some of the practice that I think is. I don't know if there's a misconception, that's probably the way to put it, but I think it's just not understanding what a college practice looks like and it's not a bunch of individual attention. Once the team period starts, right? Once you get done with your stretching, like to your point, everything that you do is about the gameplay. Like, yeah, you take batting practice, but we all know batting practice has got a thousand different moving parts. You got shortstops working on specific things, double play feeds, whatever it might be. Outfielders are tracking baseballs. You've got guys down here working on bunting. If it's. Bunting is something that you value. You guys got. Doing everything is tied to the gameplay stuff. And it's such a different environment for high school kids. I think it can be that transition their first fall. It's always really interesting to see which kids can kind of assimilate into it really quickly versus some guys who are used to high school pace or they're used to drill work within their hitting coach or their pitching coach and they don't. It takes them a little bit longer to wrap their head around. Like for these, this two hour window, we're focusing on doing things that help us win games, right? The situational stuff, you know, depending on what you value offensively, like you're going to work on very specific things. And it's such a huge transition. I think it's one of the things that goes on talked about the most with guys who go from high school to college. It's, it's not the first spring, it's the first fall that is like that eye opening moment of like, oh, wait a minute, this is different. The intensity is different. The level of competition is different. The, the, the need for focus is paramount. Can you take coaching? Can you move fast? Can you keep up? Like it's, it's difficult. [00:20:44] Speaker C: I would tell you that if there's one thing that if Any aspiring college player takes from this. Excuse me. It is. When you get to your first fall. I don't care if it's junior college, division three, two, one, mid major, high mid major. The first two weeks, three weeks of team practice, you're going to have no idea what's going on. Like, you, you are. Your head is going to be. You're going to be running around like a chicken with his head cut off. [00:21:19] Speaker A: Your. [00:21:20] Speaker C: Your head is going to be spinning. Why? I think the tempo, I think the expectations, I think the, the. The attention to detail. I mean, we're talking about what foot to hit on the right part of the bag. We're talking about what foot to. To return the bag to. On a seal. Play the right posture with that. Like, I mean, we may spend 10 minutes on. On sealing a guy at first base with a lefty pick move, because if you don't do it the right way, you're not going to the right part of the bag with the right base with the right posture with your chest. Like, there's a big difference in that. And getting guys to, Getting young players to understand how to practice is a process. And I'm hard on the freshman. I'll be the first to tell you that. And I think our young guys will tell you that, too. [00:22:17] Speaker A: The first two weeks. [00:22:18] Speaker C: There have been multiple times where I go up to a freshman, hey, man, you need to practice better. Like, just understand this. Like, you're talented. Like, but. And you've got it in you, but you've got to practice better. Just like in Beep, you talk about batting practice. Like, okay, you get a fungo. You make a throw, turn around, not run through it. Throw, and then like, turn your back like a next pitch is coming. There'll be times like, I'm stopping throwing BP and I'm turning around, I'm like, hey, turn your head around. You're gonna die. Like, you're, you're gonna die like you are going to get hit in the temple because you're not paying attention. Knowing what bag to throw to. Like, when we're switching it. Make sure, like, you're making eye contact with your feeder because sometimes, like, we may have our weekend starter catching up at second base because he doesn't want to be out in the outfit. He wants to do something. And you better not mess up and throw the ball wrong back. Taking your live reps in the outfield at game speed. You're not a. You're not a shagger. Like, you are getting game reps. Like, that is My, my biggest pet peeve. Like I, as head coach, I've tried to be, not be a cage creeper during batting practice. I purposely, over the last four years have really tried to not be around the cage. I want to be in the middle of field or I want to be with the infielders. I want to be the base runners or if I'm around the cage, like, I try to keep my mouth shut. Like, I try to have really good discipline with it because that's not the time for it. [00:23:56] Speaker B: Right? [00:23:56] Speaker C: Like you, you want to say something to a kid because you want to make him better. But that's the hitting coach's job. He's throwing BP or he's behind the cage, like, that's fine. Like, my job is to coach the team. So if our freshman outfielders are not taking their, the rep that they're getting at game speed, well, that's my responsibility to make sure that they understand that and getting them to understand all of those little small details of what it takes to practice the right way. It's a challenge, man, because it's just, and it's not a, it's not a knock on any high school coach. It's just this is our livelihood. Like, we spend hours planning practice. We spend, you know, months creating the right type of culture and what we expect out of our guys. And, you know, we're not worried about coaching or teaching five periods of math. Right. So it's like get out there and you just take around balls and hit. It's like there's way more that goes into it in planning a practice and the details and the things that you need to cover. So it's just different. It's just different for guys that it takes them some time to adjust. For sure. [00:25:14] Speaker A: Yeah. I think it's one of the biggest things that, that first fall is incredibly tough for most. I would argue probably 98% of the kids. Yes. In, in college baseball, just because for everything you just talked about, and we've talked about this before on here, and I'll hit it again. Like, you know the, like the base running stuff. Right. And it's, it's not a knock on the high school coach, but how much time can, can you legitimately spend in a high school practice to do it? And then I like, I would always take it a step further. There would be times in my career, like you'd have to take the freshman catchers aside and do like rudimentary base running stuff because in summer ball they speed up the game and run for the Catcher, those kids never run the basis and they get the cut. Like, yo, there's no speed up the game rule here. Like, you legitimately have to have a basic understanding of how to. Like, I can't put you in the game if you don't know how to run the bases. And we're talking, like, how to take a lead, how to come back to the. Like, hey, if we're going first to third, what are we doing here? Like, I touch second and go to third. Like, okay, what's your sequence there? Well, what do you do when. When you. Before you take your lead, what do you have to do? I have to make sure the pitcher has the ball. Okay. That's one of the many things that you have to do. What else do you have to do? Like, I don't know. Like, what about our outfield positioning and outfield depth? I. No idea. Okay, well, you need to know that on every single time before you take a lead. You need to know where the outfielders are playing. Doesn't matter what base you're on. Got to know where they are. And it's just like, things like that. [00:27:00] Speaker B: Like. [00:27:00] Speaker A: And it's not. It's so tough. And it's. I don't. I don't want to say it's tough. It is tough, but it's. There's so much more that goes into it than people legitimately know. I don't even want to say. Think it's more than they actually know goes into it. And like, we're not even getting into bump Ds and first and thirds and cuts and relays and where do you have to be and who's making calls. And, you know, like, when I was at rpi, we had, you know, we had different calls for the ball between infielders and outfielders. So that if. If outfielders crashing and infielders are going out, I don't want them both yelling ball. Because then if they're yelling over each other, like, you know, infielders yelled me. Outfielders yelled ball. So if you heard ball and you're an infielder, you're peeling off because outfielder has priority there. And, you know, so, like, we. And it's little things like that that, you know, and everyone has their own, you know, different kind of system. But, like, we would put those things in, and then you'd catch an outfield, an infielder yelling ball. Like, no, dude, infielders do not yell ball here. That's not what we do. Like, we say me or, you know, and it changed year to year. But whatever it was we had, it was a different sequence with, with how we did things. And, you know, I think that it's a. It's such a hard jump right away because you're going to feel like you're drinking water out of a fire hydrant. And it's. You have to learn to slow the game down for yourself. And that comes with time, that comes with, with reps. And I do think in. In the vast majority of us in this game, like, we understand that where you're coming from and where, where you're at, like, you're not gonna know everything, but there has to be some effort on your part to legitimately try to learn this stuff and start making those jumps. And, you know, I remember, I tell the story all the time. Like, I remember we were doing cuts and relay. We were doing double cuts, my friend. Freshman year day, it was like day three of practice. Coach Roku is just banging fungos into the gaps. And I, dude, I'm. I'm yelling two on double cuts. And he just kept looking at me and I'm like, I don't know what I'm doing. We never ran a double cut ever in my life. And he is just standing on shortstop yelling, figure it out. And I'm like, I don't even know what to figure out. I don't know. Like, I. I've never done this. Like, what the heck is going on right now? And then, you know, come to find out. Like, your key is first base. Like, if there's no one on first, it's a three call. If there's a run around first, it's a four call. Then we adjust from there and like, just that simple. That simple thing is like, oh, okay. Like, that makes a lot more sense now. So, like, we don't care about second. Like, no, we're like, we're. It's an auto double. We're conceding it. Like, oh, okay, well, that makes more sense to me now. But it took. It took a good seven eight of him just banging fungos. And I'm like, two. Everyone's like, yo, there is no two call. I'm like, I don't know where the ball should go. I'm just. I'm just gonna sit here and wear it. And, you know, I. I couldn't figure it out for a good 15 minutes. And then after that it was fine. But like, it's things like that that you've never. You've never done before. And I think, like, it's. It can be intimidating. It can be, you know, you, you're afraid not to screw up because you want to be perfect because you've always been the guy where you're coming from. Like, you got to get over that part of it. Like, you're not the dude anymore. Like, very few freshmen are going to walk onto a college campus regardless of level and be the guy right away. And even if you are, there's going to be things in your game that are deficient that you are going to have to work on to bring it along. And I think that freshman fall is, you know, you're going to be talking about things that you, you've never actually thought mattered in a baseball game. And I do think, and it's so different too. Like, you know, when, when we're talking data and we're talking, you know, the college game versus the pro game versus the high school game and all those things. Like, we, there's a lot of trickle down that we always see from through, you know, the big leagues into college and on down. But like, at its core, the college game is, is, it's a different game than the pro game. Like, if a ball hits a glove at the pro game, like, you're out 99% of the time. Like, that's not the case in college baseball. You might have a freshman playing third and a sophomore on the bump late in a game who can't field his position. Like, I think you're an idiot to not bunt in a situation where you need to get the runner to third or get him into scoring position at the top of your lineup. Why would you not? Like, yeah, in pro ball it's an out 99% of the time. In college it might be an out 80% of the time given the situation. So, like, take your chances. It's just, it's such a different game and I think sometimes we get lost in, in some of that stuff from a bit and you know, the other side, obviously, like over 162 games that plays itself out. Like we're in a 56 game sprint to the finish where almost every game matters. Like, you don't really have throwaway games to be like, ah, you know what, we're just going to dump this Tuesday midweek because we can and ultimately it's not going to matter. Like, are there situations? Sure. Like we're, we're a little banged up and we're going to run some freshmen out there to give guys an entire week off and we're playing lord only knows who. So like, whatever we can dump this one, because this weekend is far more important. But that's not like you're not doing that every Tuesday or Wednesday. No, you want to go out there and win them because if you don't, like maybe you haven't bid at that large 100% that matters. And I think that like that's where you know, they're, they're, there's such a difference in our game and why that stuff matters in the, in the fall for practice and, and you know, you have to be in shape to practice baseball at the college level. Like that's like, you don't really need to be in game shape. Like realistically we can all go out there and probably play a nine inning game, the three of us. I don't know how we feel the next day, but there's no way, there's no way the three of us can go through a full week of practice and of six days. You know what I mean? Like, we'd be like day five, I'm tapping out my, my knees are going to be killing me, my back hurts, my arm's gonna fall off. Like the, the in shape part is generally geared around practice and what you're going to be doing there versus like the straight up game stuff. And it's such a, it's such a different, a different feel and a different modality I suppose from, from high school and even summer ball. Like there's a lot more attention to detail and things that you're going to have to learn in order to, to, to legitimately give yourself a chance to be an option to potentially play in the spring. [00:33:59] Speaker C: Yeah, that. You said a lot of really, really good things there, Keith. Probably one of the best lessons I've learned. When I started getting into coaching, Coach Rooney told me this, you'd ask me a question. I'm like, I assume, I assume it's correct. I would say that a lot. Early on he's like, A.J. don't assume, don't assume that when you're setting up our team meal, even though you've done it three times. Like, don't assume that that place knows what time to come. Like make sure over and over again. Don't assume that the freshman knows how to take a lead the right way off the bag. Like you'd be shocked. Like first day, it's like, all right guys, like take your lead off the bag and then have them do their secondary and like we'll, we'll do it five to ten times until they get the tempo right, till they get the right length of their, of their secondary. They're not clicking their heels, they're not getting overextended, they're not taking little stutter steps. They've got good rhythm, they've got good tempo with it. Those are important. Is it important? It has to be important on September 7th as much as it's important in May when he takes an incorrect secondary slips because he's overextended himself and then he gets back picked and then you lose the game in the conference tournament. So like it can't be like important to you when you screw up. Like you have to implement. This is how we're going to play, this is how we're going to do things. And you can't assume anything. I assume nothing. It doesn't matter like or teaching guys how to bunt. You talk about how the college game is different than, than the pros. A thousand percent. A thousand percent. Like we're gonna be passionate about having a right two strike approach because. Why? Well, if you strike out at a 40% clip, well, you better hit 20 homers because I'm not watching you hit.270 with three home runs and you strike out once every three and a half bad bats. I'm not watching it. Like there has to be the right approach. There has to be buy into situationally hit. There has to be. If you're a type of guy that's athletic and that's the way that we recruit, we want athletic players that can run. You got to be able to dominate the short game, you got to be able to handle the short game, you got to be able to handle the bat. Like you've got to be able to, to take it in a bat the right way. You get the pro ball and you're making millions of dollars. Like you can play however you want. And it's not. You're not gonna play for me anymore. But like you're gonna play, you're going to play hard, you're going to play your ass off every single time that you're on the field. There's a certain standard, there's a certain style and there's a certain expectation and it's going to be ingrained in you every single day. And it's not. We've got a lot of good players, right? So like you've got to, it's your responsibility every day when you show up to practice that you're mentally, physically, emotionally prepared. When you step through that gate like it's it. I want guys to have fun. I want to have it create a Great environment where guys are excited about coming to the field. But there also has to be a shift in your mindset. Like, hey man, like this is, there's a little bit of a business side of it of this as well. Like, I've chosen to be here, right? I've chosen to be at practice and spend 45 minutes doing bunting and base running instead of being at a frat doing whatever they're doing, right? Like, I'm, I'm choosing to be part of a college baseball program and getting guys to understand, like, the responsibility that they have to have for their self development. And it starts with your mindset. You gotta, it's hard, man. It's every day. You better love this game if you want to play in college. And again, that's, that's at any level. And we're fortunate to have great facilities, great resources. You know, we have everything within the capabilities that Radford has provided for us along with the people that support our program. We're very fortunate to have great supporters from a financial standpoint that allow our guys to have a great experience here. But here at a junior college, like, you don't have a strength coach, you don't have a trainer. Like, you may not even have an indoor facility. You got to figure out a way for you to get better depending on what junior college you go to. You know, our director of baseball development, he's, he was the head coach of Patrick Henry for three years, took them to the World Series. Like, he's, he's blown away by the stuff that we have. And this is at Radford, right? Like, and he tells stories all the time about guys at junior college that, like, you know, some guys are doing laundry for the team, right? Like, so, so it's when you're in a situation where you've got everything right in front of you, there's no excuse for you to not, to not be excited about coming to the field every day and, and, and buying in and being the type of player that you can be. [00:39:33] Speaker B: The, the margins are so thin. And it's why you, as a coach at the college level, like, you harp on those details. Like, you're talking about, like, how do you go back to the bag correctly on a pickoff move? Well, yeah, that doesn't matter 99 out of a hundred times, but if you do it right one time and that pickoff move is up the line a little bit and you've propped yourself up on the bag properly with good posture and you entered with the right foot, you've now organically blocked the first baseman from being able to come across the bag. That ball might go up the first baseline and you end up on third base. That run can be the difference in a game. You were talking about it earlier and I think that we have very similar thoughts on this. But most seasons are won and lost in tight games. They're not. You don't just go roll people in college all the time, like it's not how it works. Like most of them, you're looking at six, four games, five, four, seven, six, you know, eight, six, whatever the score might be. But those are tight. Usually those, those runs. The difference there is, it's usually details. Oh, a guy taking an extra base or a guy not backing up a base, or a pitcher messing up a bunt play or causing some chaos because you've really taken the time to execute the base running philosophy, like whatever it might be. Those margins are so thin. But you, you create those margins in practice with the stuff that you stress and the stuff that you focus on. And you know, we had a, we had a stat at William and Mary that Murph used to always track and he's been tracking it forever. So I'm sure he's got about 20 years of data on it now. But in that three year window, we used the biggest stat, the biggest indicator for a win was who won the free base battle. So if we created more free bases and we gave up, we won like close to 80% of the games. But people a lot of times just go to like, well, that's walks and errors. No, it's. Did you go first to third on a ball through the four hole? That's an extra base catcher who can really defend, like not giving up pass balls, not giving up wild pitches, guys throwing to the right base, like preventing a guy from going from first to third or hitting the cutoff man when you're throwing home and that guy on first base gets thrown out at second and you end an inning, like, those are the margins that exist in college baseball. It's not stress at the high school level and travel ball. And it's not an indictment. I think it's just a different game. But in college you learn how important that is in practice. Because to your point, you don't want to have to coach something that happened in a game. Because looking back and I'd be like, well, we never really covered that. Well, that's a coach problem, not a player problem. But if you give them all the information, then you stress it and you harp on it one, it becomes second nature to do the things that you value. But then on the other side of it, you've already coached it. So now if it doesn't happen in the game, which it ultimately ends up playing that way, like kids make mistakes, the game's really, really hard. But the kids understand it now because it's like, oh, now that's exactly what you were talking about. That's why that's important. So that the practice stuff is just, it's so. I didn't realize how big of a deal it was until I got a little bit older in coaching and you really start to run like a really tight practice and you really have a good understanding of what your philosophies are and the things that you value. Right. And that's all encompassing. The play hard stuff, like is the only non negotiable we had at William Mary is like you play hard everything else we can coach like, but your responsibility is you show up and you play hard every day. [00:43:20] Speaker C: Yeah, there's no doubt. And I think that practice is for, I tell our staff all the time, like practice is for us. This is our game day. Like this is, this is our time to shine. This is our time to, to feel like when we leave that gate, like did we win today as a coaching staff? Like did we feel like our team if we were to play another team? Like were we going to win or not? And if we felt like we probably would have lost today, well, we got to take a reset and evaluate and talk about what we need to do the next day. But you're so right, like the, the margin for error is so small. It's so minute. After year two we lost, we were 16 and 35, I believe was our record 18, something like that. We lost 17 games by three or less runs in the last four innings of the game. Part of that is experience, part of that is depth. It's not an indictment on our guys at all. A lot of, a lot of guys playing Division 1 baseball for the first time. It was a, it was a big turnover in our roster after year one. And that was a point of emphasis going into, going into last year. And it's been a point of emphasis even more so going into year four. Like 28 and 28 last year had the majority of our team back, had some really good newcomers along with some freshmen that are joining us this year. You know, the details of the way we go about our business was, has been stressed every single day. And I think if guys can understand how to practice and how to work and how to go about their business and they take real ownership of that. And you create an environment where, like, there you have a really good locker room and you've got really good players that are just going to push each other. I mean, kids are, kids are smart. Like, they understand, like, okay, why am I not playing? They may not want to admit it, but they understand well, how am I going to get better? Work, just work, work. Play your ass off, compete your ass off. Be a great teammate. Good things will happen to you. It may not be in the time frame that you want, but if you can stick to that and you can have consistency in your day to day. I didn't figure it out until I. [00:45:58] Speaker A: Was. [00:46:00] Speaker C: 21 years old. And that's a God's honest truth, right? I didn't figure out to my red shirt junior year, halfway through, thank God, I had another year, but there was of a lot of, of kickback on my own, from my own personal side of it, of figuring out, like, how to go about my business the right way, how to work properly, how to understand, you know, the type of coaching that I was getting. And then once I could like, figure those things out, like, I opened up a whole new door for, for myself. We talk about playing for Joe. Like my red shirt year, I play, I took ground balls of shortstop just to even out. I couldn't play that year. Sorry. So we just, so that we had another shortstop to give him a, you know, give him a breather in between reps. And you would stand behind me every day. Your feet are too slow. Your feet are too, your feet are too slow. Speed up, speed up, speed up. Move your feet, move your feet. Get the right hop. Follow your throat. Like every single rep he was on me and I'm like, Jesus, man. Like, what is that? This guy hates me, right? The immature. Like, he doesn't like me. No, no, he really likes me. He's on me on every single rep because he PCs something in me. He wants me to get better. Embracing coaching, embracing being coached hard, I think that's another piece of it, right? Like, I'm not going to change who I am at my core. The delivery. Has that evolved over the last 15 years? Yeah, I mean, it has. But the core principles of what you're trying to get across to your players, like, that will never change. Like, that, that'll never change. And I, I think if you have good relationships with kids and, and, and you, they understand that you love them, you've got their best interests at heart. Like you can coach them however you want. Like, obviously to a degree. I. I don't believe. I don't believe in demeaning anybody. But you got to demand a lot out of these kids, right? And you talked about earlier, like, they just don't know. Like, I mean, think about the travel ball. And again, I'm not. This is not me getting on a travel ball rant. [00:48:17] Speaker B: But. [00:48:19] Speaker C: It'S different. It's different than the way the three of us were. Were growing up. I didn't play in front of a college coach my entire career. I played. Want to obey Ruth. Like, we try to win every tournament so we could move on and hopefully go up to upstate New York and play up there and win that tournament and move on and playing the Connie Macworld Series and like, that's. That's what we played for. You play with the kids that you grew up with that you were your buddies, 7, 8, 9 years old. You're playing with them in 15, 16, 17. You know, I. There was none of that. Now it's like, you could go to an event, hit a ground ball, be a five, six down the line, and then after the game, you're gonna go email college coach and say that you hit. [00:49:10] Speaker A: You. [00:49:10] Speaker C: You had a 101 exit below on a. [00:49:12] Speaker A: On a. [00:49:13] Speaker C: On a base hit with a grainy video, and you're gonna send out to every coach in the country, and then you're gonna get jammed up while you're not being being recruited. It's like, well, how is that your game, dude? Like, I watched you play like, you didn't even know the outs. Now you're sending me an email about, like, with some shitty video. Like, no, I'm not recruiting you. Like, it's. Just because you're playing travel ball doesn't give you the entitlement to be recruited. Like, you still got to be able to go out there and. And be a dude and play, like, Division 1 baseball. Like, we're playing Virginia Tech, West Virginia, Tennessee. Like, we played the number one team in the country last year. Like, not many team, not many kids get the opportunity to do that. Like, so understand, like, it when you're going through this process, like, and we're evaluating you, like, there's. There's a lot that goes into it. There is a lot that goes into it. More than just your physical capabilities. But to get on that, like, to kind of close out the practice piece of it, like, that's. That is such a huge piece of your growth as a player. Like, you talk about under, like, having A feel for and getting acclimated at college. Like you're on your own for the first time. Mommy and daddy are not coming in your room and waking you up. Like, you got to have a lot of discipline. You got to have a lot of, of structure within your own life. Like is your room clean, is your locker clean, is your car clean? Like, are you caught up on your laundry? Are you caught up on your schoolwork? Are you doing the stuff in study hall? Like, did you map out your day so that you can go get community service hours in? You know, if you have a class situation, like, are you communicating properly to our strength coach or to your trainer to make sure that you're getting the, getting rehab in at a different time or you're getting your lift in at a different time? Like are you able to structure out your day where you can get up to the field earlier or are you the guy that shows up four minutes before practice, scrambling, rushing to put your cleats on, but you've been out of class for two hours and you've just been, you know, dillying around like how to prepare, how to prepare for practice. There's a lot of, there's a lot that goes into it. Like it's, and there's different stages and guys get it and it clicks for them at a different time. Sometimes they gotta face adversity in order for them to make adjustments in, in their day to day life. But yeah, that first semester, man, it's, it's a wake up call. I don't care how good of a player you are, I don't care how prepared you may think you may be. It's just like how I was when I became a head coach. Like I thought I was prepared and I was prepared to do things I can control. But like then there are certain things that, that come up that like you just got to figure out on the fly and you got to make adjustments as you go. You know, my biggest fear now as head coach is like making sure that I know every rule in the rulebook. Like, because if there's something goes on, like I, it's my job to make sure that I, I'm arguing the right thing. I have some type of ground to stand on if I'm going to go out there with an umpire. Like I ever. So every single winter time, like I read the rule book, I study the thing, I'll call umpires every year. Like, hey, am I reading this the right way? Like, so if this happens, like, is this the way things, things should Go. And that's my responsibility, to be able to make sure our team is prepared. [00:52:55] Speaker B: Yeah, the, the barrier to entry in college has changed quite a bit. Like. And we can. Yeah, we can get into that a little bit later. Like, in terms of, you know, you got all these rule changes, but the expectation and what is needed every day just to. Just to get in the mix. I think sometimes gets. Gets lost in the shuffle. And like, you talked about the play hard stuff. Like high school guys who are listening to this, like, if you. The easiest way to get crossed off a coach's list is to not run hard down the first baseline and not play hard. Like, you don't really have time for that kind of stuff. [00:53:31] Speaker C: But I have no time for that. I would say that right now. [00:53:35] Speaker B: I'm curious, like, no time for it. I don't want to say that it's easy, but it's not hard to find talented players. There's plenty of them, right? Oh, there's. There's plenty of them out there. You have things that you value. The play art stuff, the details, the commitment. And you understand all of the pieces of the puzzle. The kids like boxes they have to check in order to just kind of keep their head above water. Is there anything that you try to do during the recruiting process or anything that you really value in the recruiting process that kind of tips you off on, like, this is the right type of kid? Because we talked about it earlier. Like, it's such a big piece of the puzzle. Like, when you took over the head job at Radford, you were trying to pick up the pieces and get the program back to where it was, where you. When you were there previously with Joe, when you were winning 45 games. And you know that's the goal is to get back to that. But you talked about how important it was to get the right people. Yeah, I know it's. It's a murky equation. And if anybody had the answer. But is there anything that you feel like that gives me some evidence that this kid is going to be able to get here in that learning curve isn't going to be as steep. [00:54:49] Speaker C: Yes. I think the first piece of it is let's not. Let's not lie to ourselves here. Got to be a talented player. That's the first part that. That's obvious. I think you have to. First as a coach, you've got to evaluate, like, how do we want to play, how do we want to play offensively, what type of position player profile am I looking for? And everybody's different, like there's, there's no right or wrong answer. It's just a matter of, of the style that you want to play with. So for us, like, we, we've, we've defined that as a staff. Like, we want athletic players that can play the middle of the field, that can handle the bat. We want guys that can, that can run if possible, but if you cannot defend the field, like, you've got a really difficult time staying on the field every single day. I want to be able to coach guys that can handle the bat, that can do a lot of different things for us offensively that can bunt, that can run. You know, I think the power piece is, is the last thing as a hitter that will come. And part of that is just what you do in the weight room. And, you know, you'd be getting older and getting that maturation process, a hitter and understanding when there's time so to leverage the baseball. And the reality is, like, we're not going to get the pure power hitter at high school. Like, that kid's going to go to a Power 4 school because those guys, that's what those guys are looking for. So defining what you want positionally, pitching wise, like, if you're projectable and you've got long levers and you're athletic and you're mid-80s, man, sign me up. I'm good. Because I know the Velo is going to come eventually. I know the Velo is going to come eventually. We're not going to get the guy that's 92 to 95 with three pitches to both sides of the plate at 6 2. My kid's going to go to the Power 4 school and that's okay. We recognize that, you know. Or are you going to take the kid that's got a power arm that may have some command issues, like, not to say that we haven't in the past, but you can't build, build an entire staff around that because you're going to have a really difficult time to win. One guys are going to throw strikes and want. Guys are going to defend the field. I want Gu going to handle the bat and that are athletic and can play multiple positions. So that's the first piece of it when, when we're going out and recruiting, like, if you're doing your leg work and you're doing your homework and, and you're, you're preparing the right way, like, just like you're going into a game, like you're going to go in, you're going to, you're not going to go into it blind most of the time. So you're going to know that these kids are good players. Right? [00:57:43] Speaker B: So. [00:57:45] Speaker C: How do they play catch? How do they warm up? I like to get to, if possible, I like to get to the games and get to the field early. I like to watch how they interact with their teammates. I'm going to be able to talk to the coaches, hear what they have to say about them. But then once they get on campus. Andy, I, I think that the verbiage that these kids use is a huge, huge sign. Like, to me, there are a lot of red flags when, when kids are on a visit that you can sift through and you can. This has been over the course of time that I've just experienced and just reflecting back on, on when kids are on campus, when kids are talking about themselves and how, like. Well, I just want to, like, I just want to play early on. Okay, well, that's everybody. I get that. When kids are asking you, how many players are you recruiting at my position? When they're asking a lot of questions, that can be almost like they, they are trying to paint the perfect picture for themselves to be successful when they get there versus I just want an opportunity and I just want to win. Like, if they're asking a lot of questions about the gear and some of the fluff things, those are red flags because I, I think that we need, we need blue collar, tough kids to be successful at rapper. And we need, we need kids that are totally entrenched with winning and being a great teammate and are just going to work their, work their ass off. That's it. Like, they don't ask a lot of questions about, you know, where do you see me in two years, man? Like, listen, we've got 34 spots. Every spot is important. If you're on this roster, you're gonna have an opportunity to play. The best players play. I don't care if you show up and walk on tryouts. I don't care if you're a transfer from the University of Texas. It doesn't matter. The best players play. And I think that the, you gotta, as a coach, like, be really, really conscious of the, the words that are being said to you during the visit. You can be able to sift through a lot of stuff during that. A lot of stuff. [01:00:28] Speaker B: I think that's some really good advice for the listeners in terms of how you phrase stuff and, you know, like kind of going in with the understanding. Like every kid who's in your program is important. You're going to try to figure out a way to make them as productive as they can. The reality is, is that, you know, in any given year, you probably only got like eight or nine guys you really want to throw, but it doesn't mean that the other six arms don't matter. You still got to develop them. You still got to bring them along. You know, you hit on the meritocracy thing. It's interesting you bring that up about guys who want an opportunity and they want to win. And Joe told a story about Spencer Horowitz and how he basically wasn't getting recruited, got an opportunity, was just like, yes, sign me up. Like, you believe in me. Like, I'm in. And just there wasn't any of that fluff that you're talking about. And fast forward. Yep, the dudes gonna sign up what will likely be a pretty lucrative contract here in the next couple years. [01:01:31] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, for sure. [01:01:32] Speaker B: And that's a kid who wasn't a high scholarship dude. [01:01:38] Speaker C: Nope. [01:01:39] Speaker B: For lack of a better term. And I'm not putting Joe words in Joe's mouth, but like, kind of an afterthought, kind of like a later guy in the class. [01:01:47] Speaker C: Oh, 100. The only reason we. The reason we got Spencer is because we were recruiting guys on. On his team. But every time we watched him play, he just kept hitting doubles and it was like he couldn't. He was one of the catchers that we were looking at, but he couldn't catch. He wasn't a catcher. It was one of those things. Another funny moment of Joe. But like, hey, like, what about Spencer? It's like, well, we don't need a catcher. Yeah, but he can hit. Yeah, but we don't need a catcher. Yeah, but he can hit. Okay, well then you're the head coach. Then get him. No problem. But that's what you want to do. But you told me, like, this is what you want. But that's all he did. He just hit and hit and hit. And you're right. Like, opportunity came, boom, he jumped on it. I think when you go through the recruiting process as well and you offer a kid and like, they commit either on the spot or they commit within 48 hours, 72 hours. Like, you know, you've got a kid that's really excited about your program, and I think the majority we. We haven't. I don't put timelines on kids. I've told them, like, you. You'll know when you know. I think the longer it drags out, the less of a chance that you have it at, at a kid in, in any situation. I think it's, it's, it's a challenge, right? Unless you're at probably a Power 4 school and, and you got to kind of deal with some of the fluff. I think some of those kids think that it's similar to football recruiting, but we're not dealing with. It's. This is not a football recruiting type of deal where like I'm sitting around like waiting at the printer or waiting at my email for you to like, pick a hat and then you send in your, your, your signed agreement. It's not the case. Like, kids that want to be a Radford and commit here really quickly, it's because they, they want to be here. And I think that is once you get a kid on canvas and you evaluate that they can play for you at that point, you just want them to be excited about, about being there. [01:04:07] Speaker B: And it's. [01:04:08] Speaker C: And, and that rapper's on an afterthought. And I think it, you know, at a lot of mid majors, like, sometimes you can be the afterthought, right? Like, everybody's got dreams of playing at the highest level. I wanted to go to the University of Miami until I went to University of Miami camp, and then I realized I was not going to go to the University of Miami really quickly. That's okay, is what it is, right? I ended up exactly where I needed to be. But I look at this place like this is, this is my school. Like, as far as I say that, not because I'm head coach, I say that as, as a player, like I have ownership of it as, as an alum. Just like for you two guys, like Marist is your program, right? It's like that, that's. You guys have, you have stock in that place. You have the, You've earned the right to say that is my program. Radford is my program. So like, I'm going to have a hard time being second fiddle to anybody and I'm going to have a hard time with guys that are not going to jump and be really excited about having the opportunity to play Division 1 baseball at a place that's got everything that you need to accomplish your, Your dreams. And I, you know, you just got to be able to filter through and, and really listen and pay attention to some of these, some of the things that these kids say. Like, that would be my best advice for, for families when you're going. And, and it's hard because they're, they're listening to other people. Give them Advice like, ask them how many players they're recruiting in this class. Ask them how many shortstops are recruiting. Ask them how many catchers are recruiting. No, don't ask that question. If you're in that office, you're in that office for a reason. Because you're a good player and because we feel like you are the right fit. Are we going to recruit seven catchers? No. But if you're a catcher, right, like you're one of three to four guys on our roster. If you're a fourth guy, like we'd like for you to be able to play another position. But this is not, this is not football where like you've got 90 kids and it's a depth thing. Like every spot is precious, every single spot is precious. And if you're looking for the perfect situation, there's no such thing. And if a coach is going to tell you that, then he's lying. If a coach sits there and tells you you're going to start for us, he's lying to you. Like, and if that's the place where you need to be at to have somebody that's going to molly collar you and like promise you things, then you're setting yourself up for disappointment. Because is there an expectation in our minds like, okay, we're bringing this kid in, like, we feel like he's going to be the guy for us. Yeah, of course. But it doesn't always work out that way. There have been plenty of guys that I, I've expected to, to play as soon as they come on campus, whether they're a transfer or whether they're a young guy and they, they don't get on there until later on in their career or they never get on the field. And the guys that are not as recruited, they jump them because of their intangibles and their makeup. And I know, I know I'm kind of jumping around a bit. But going back to what you had asked earlier, like, as far as the way that these kids play the game, I think that's probably, that's more of the frustrating piece for me and I think a lot of coaches will, will echo this. Like we've got a stopwatch on our hand. Like, okay, you ground out to short. I'm sure you want to hit a double, but bust your ass down the line. I'm trying to get a line time on you. If you take a good swing and you're a left handed hitter and you're a 41 down the line, I'm going to stay and I'm going to watch your next at bat. I mean, you show me that you can run. You show me that you, that you can defend. You show me that you're an athlete. It's awesome. Now like the other piece of it is the, the maturity and the mental side of it. Okay, you just had a bad of bat. Are you going to be the shortstop that's going to go out there and jog out to his position, Take infield or not, or throw the ball 100 miles an hour over the first baseman's head, Scream cuss words into your glove like that's a turn off? Is that like, look, I'm an intense, competitive person. Like, I have some grace with that. I think part of that is also coaching because like, your coach shouldn't allow you to go about your business that way. But if you do, then it's allowed. Then you're going to continue to do it like any child, right? But if you're constantly doing it well, then I'm just going to write you off because it's another, it's another thing I'm gonna have to coach out of you when you get here. And we don't have time for that. You know, I'm saying, like, I, I want to coach you on the things that are going to make you the, the player that you want to be and take you to the next, the next level. And if we're wasting time on coaching you on how to play the game, your work ethic, your energy, your competitiveness, how coachable you are, if we're wasting time, we're spinning our wheels because we're never going to maximize our potential because we're constantly fighting these little battles every single day of things that you can control, you know. So like, sometimes the best weekends, I'll be honest with you, is when like you go watch players and you cross them off, that's the best. So sometimes those are the most productive weekends as coaches because you're not getting inundated with this, with these names like, nah, man, I've already seen him. Like, he's not, he's not a guy for us. I'm sorry. We move on. And now with the Portal, like as a high school kid, like, the reality of it is like, you better be, you better be a good player. Like, you better do everything right. Like, you better be talented regardless of what position you play. You better have talent and have ability and have skills and show us that like you can assimilate to the Division 1 game and not waste time. But on top of that the way that you go about your business, how hard you work, how coachable you are, how competitive you are, the type of teammate that you are, you know, that's huge. That is huge with me. You're not gonna be a good teammate, man. Like, like, you're out. Like, I'm not, I'm not dealing with that. [01:11:03] Speaker A: Right. [01:11:04] Speaker B: Because. [01:11:06] Speaker C: As head coach, you're looking around and you know you've got however many position players, you've got two thirds of your position players on the bench that are good players. Like, they better be good kids and understand, like, at some point my time's coming, I got to keep working. If you got a selfish kid in that locker room that's going to be pissed off because he's not playing, that can destroy your team. Right. Like, and that's, that's the legwork in the background that you do with coaches and, but there's a lot that goes into it, right? Like, recruiting is much different. And if we don't feel like we're, I want to be able to recruit high school kids. I still believe that you should build your roster and build your team with high school kids. But the portal has allowed us to not rush and make in informed decisions like you. I want to feel really good about the high school kids that we're bringing in. You know, and it's, it's, it's not always a metric. It's not always about how fast you're on a 60. It's not always about how hard you hit the ball. Like, it, Those things are important in evaluating. Absolutely. But you can't, you can't put a price tag on those intangibles that I talked about. And in production, like, you go out there and you produce every time I watch you play, and you do something to help your team win or you do something to show everybody that you're a college player, then even by the way that you, like, wear your jersey, even by the way that you play catch, even by the way that you fix your glove, like, all those little things, I, I, I seriously think that those are those actions. The, like, good players do those things. My grandmother, may she rest in peace, both of them, if they came and watched you play, they should walk away from the field going, hey, that number, that number nine, like, he's really good. He's a really good player. And every single time, if you're playing in college, you should have someone in the stands compliment you. I don't care if you go 0 for 4 or 4 for 4. If you're playing at any level in college, you should have somebody compliment, compliment you with the way that you go about your business, the way that you talk, the way that you communicate, the type of teammate you are, the way that you played the game. Forget about production. If you can have that type of mentality, more times than not, you're gonna. [01:13:44] Speaker B: Be a good player. I think the, the only thing I would add to that is that you can't flip the switch right. You know, you're, you're in Virginia. You know, so many of those high school coaches, like you can get to the truth of it where you can call Pudge and say, hey man, I saw this kid, I really liked him. Like, is the version of the kid that I saw this weekend who played his ass off. Is that the dude who shows up for you every day? Because, you know, eventually you get found out if you just, you know, if you're kind of a front runner and you play hard when things are going well, like, you get found out. But the consistency of it, like, it's not really an option when you get to college. Like, if you want to be a good player at the college level, one of the strongest traits you can have is just consistently showing up every day and playing hard. And it's no different than in high school because if you don't have that. And Keith, Keith knows how I feel about this. Like high motor guys give them to me every day of the week if they've got the prerequisite skills and the talent like we talked about, like, you need to meet, meet a certain barrier depending on the program that you're going at. But give me the high mortar dude, because you can get the most out of that kid. But the kid that you have to motivate to play hard, there's just too many. To your point, there's too many other options out there nowadays. Like, there's plenty of high school talent. And then now if you don't feel great about a position that you're evaluating in your high school class, like, you can just wait because you have the portal and you don't. To your point, you don't have to make. You don't have to make a guess, you don't have to make a projection. And that was something that you know to a certain extent when you're in that mid major level, like we were at William and Mary and like you guys are at Radford, like, sometimes you got to gamble on, like, that kid's freaking raw. But if it clicks, he's got a chance to be different. Right, because the tool sets there. And like, you know, sometimes you gamble on that kid. But I don't think you really have to do that as much anymore, more just because of the nature of the recruiting landscape. With you just got options, you've got a lot more options to. To find kids and you don't have to rush. And then to your point, the. The roster spots now, like, they're precious. 34, man. It's not a lot. No, it's a lot. And like, you can't have on the back end of your roster anymore. You need to be able to develop guys, and those guys need to be able to contribute some way, shape or form, whether it's as a really good teammate or a guy who might be a year away. But you can't waste roster spots anymore. That 40 gave coaches a bigger buffer than I think it looks like on paper. Like, having six extra guys, you got to take six chances, basically. You can take that talented arm who doesn't throw strikes and just pray to God that he figures it out, or you could take like, the super grinder kid whose tools don't really apply, but you really love the kid and, like, maybe he'll be able to figure out a way to be competitive now. You don't have to stretch for those guys anymore. No. [01:16:59] Speaker C: No, you don't. 100%. [01:17:01] Speaker B: No. [01:17:03] Speaker A: Well, you didn't have to stretch for him. But the other thing, though, is, like, you have to hit on the guys that are going to be on your roster. Right? [01:17:11] Speaker C: Like you would. [01:17:13] Speaker A: And it's not to say that it, like, if I had six extra guys or six extra spots, like, yeah, you can take some guys and maybe they are that kid that pushes that highly recruited kid and ultimately might take that job. But there's a lot that has to happen for that to. To come to fruition. And I think in. In the current landscape, there's no. It's a. [01:17:36] Speaker C: It's no. [01:17:37] Speaker A: There's no risk. When we were at 40, there was no risk, because what's. At the end of the year, you just be like, hey, I think it's gonna work out here. Just jump in the portal and you can go get another guy. Where now it's going to be a little bit more. The. The premium is making sure that you hit at a high clip with the guys that you're bringing into your roster. Because 34, while 6 doesn't sound like a lot, it is, especially from a roster standpoint like you. You need to make sure that you are bringing in the correct people and that you're, you're going to be able to develop those kids, that they're going to actually want to work. They're going to, you know, they're going to commit to being developed. They're going to do the things it is that you want in your program. Because if you get two or three guys that all of a sudden don't want to do that, like now you're going to look down the bench and be like, we're, we legitimately are running out of 30 man roster because I have three or four guys that are just dead weight in this program. And Lord help you if you end up with injuries. Like now all of a sudden it's like, yo, we're at 27 guys. So like, you need to make sure that you're like, you're bringing in the correct people to ultimately do what it is that you want to do in your program. Like sixes, you know, from a. And when you do, you bear it out, like, yeah, it's 1800 people and blah, blah, blah. But like, you know, it doesn't seem like a lot of people, but ask any coach, like 40 going like a 40 man roster is I think in some regards more of a headache than it is anything else. [01:19:07] Speaker C: You're 100% right. [01:19:08] Speaker A: I had, I had 40 my last year at RPI because of COVID And I was like this like the amount of headaches I have with 40 man rosters versus a 35 man roster and like, it doesn't seem like much like five people, but there's so much more. And it's just like dealing with those types of things, it takes you away from the coaching aspect of things and doing some of that stuff and like then like you feel that pull and you know, when, you know, and I was by myself, like it got to the point with some of it where I was just like, I don't, I don't have time for this. Like, I'm going to devote my time to the 35 guys that legitimately want to be here and do this. Like, I, if you want to turn your jersey in, I don't care, just give it back to me. I'll see you when I see it. Like, it doesn't matter to me, you know, but I, I think that like, I, for a lot of things, I think that going to 34 and the new contact rule and all being able to kind of slow it down and you know, like you said be, you know, you don't necessarily have to make decisions as early as we were six, seven, eight years ago on guys of like, let's try to get this kid committed be when his software sophomore year starts where now like you can see a kid develop and maybe those kids that you know are a little bit slower, like they pop junior year and it's like, oh, okay. Like this is a kid that I kind of liked what he did before. He was a tad bit short, but you know, he clearly got after in the weight room and he's developed and he's gotten a lot better. Like, this is a guy that we're going to recruit now. I like for all of those things that I think are positives, I do think, like there's going to be more of them. Like you're going to be under more of a microscope from a recruiting standpoint because we're going to 34. And whether it's going to happen in the recruiting process or when you get to campus, like until we have a legit fall roster size, I think in some regards, like, it might not matter, but that stuff is going to weed itself out in the fall where it's going to be like, yeah, no, like that's. We're not dealing with that. We'll see you. But some programs are going to put an emphasis on it in the recruiting process of like, hey, we're going to put a microscope on these kids and make sure that we're bringing in the right kids because not every mid major is going to be able to bring in more, you know, a giant fall roster. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, and eventually I do think there's going, like there are, there's going to be a point of diminishing returns, of big bringing in more than what you need because it's going to get to the point where it's like, well, we have 45 guys in the fall. Like, it's like those 11 guys are taking away reps that we need for the guys that the 34 that we're ultimately going to take. Now if you want to take 36 and maybe, you know, to get cut at the end of December or beginning of December, I, I could understand that. But I think there's going to come a point of diminishing return with it. And I, I could see it flipping more to the, you know, let's put a microscope on all of this stuff that we certain we value, whether it's high school kids or transfer portal kids or juco kids, whatever it is, it's gonna be a little bit slower because I think it's Gonna get to the point of like, why, why are we wasting time with an extra 15, you know, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15 guys that we kind of know aren't gonna make it. What's. What's the point in doing that? [01:22:25] Speaker B: You know? [01:22:26] Speaker A: So I, I think there's a lot of really good. I think a lot of the things that we've done in this game are, Are. Have. Have done a very good job of slowing this stuff down. And it's. We're gonna see the development of kids and probably see kids that in years past, the, you know, 10 years ago when we were doing this, we're certainly not Division 1 guys when people were committing right away. But. And we saw it, right? We saw kids that you passed on when they were younger, and then all of a sudden they're playing, they're playing against you and they're, you know, they're really good. It's like, damn, I wish I had a little bit more time to see that kid. And I think those kids are like, they're all going to be out there. But, you know, I think a lot of the things that coaches value from a program standpoint are going to be highlighted and intensified even more because with a smaller roster, you need to, you need to know and you know, when you're the head coach and you're making these decisions, like, ultimately, that's on you. And there's times where, you know, at the good or bad, right or wrong, like, you're the face of the program. Like, it's, there's things that I learned my first year being ed coach, I thought I, you know, I knew I didn't have it all figured out, but there were things that come up that like, I was quasi prepared for, but like, there's no, there's no book for it. It's just like, yo, you gotta figure this out. And you know, it's, it's different. Like you're, you're the one right in the lineup. You know, when you're an assistant, it's like, well, I think we should do this, this and this, but it doesn't matter, right? Like, you know, you're the one writing the lineup. Like, you're gonna have people knocking at your door after game two, like, coach, why am I not in the lineup? Like, first of all, it's game one. Let's not panic here. But these are why. Like, these are the reasons why. And it's, you know, and, and I think like a lot of younger kids, when they, when they go through this process and you get to college. It's like the, the, the, the, the go to theme is like, well, I just need an opportunity. Well, if you've listened to anything we've said in this podcast, like your opportunity is every day. It's not the game days that are your opportunity. It's not the at bats against another team. That's your opportunity. It's your opportunity every day to show up with energy, be a high motor guy, be coachable, do those things that are going to get you more opportunities to be able to do it. You know, and I think that we talked about this recently on a podcast. I was talking to one of our kids who is in college now and he was, he's a freshman. He was talking about how it was weird, like he wants to play another team. It's weird, you know, playing so much against your own team and he's an arm. I was like, yeah, but man, like you need to understand as an arm, like the majority of your, you're going to throw more times against your team than you will against an opponent in your career. Just from a fall, a falls inner squad standpoint, from a build up standpoint in the spring, like you take all of those outings, they're going to be more than what you're going to get in a regular season. Like you're probably going to throw 15, 16, 17 times against your own team. Like you, if you, if you go out, even if you're a Friday night guy, what are you getting? 15 starts? [01:25:41] Speaker C: Yep. [01:25:42] Speaker A: You know what I mean? Like you're, you're going to throw more against your own team. So you have to go prove it against those guys to get an opportunity to prove it against someone else. And then the whole process restarts itself. You have to go prove yourself against everyone else because if you're not good, we're gonna back off and we're gonna figure out how we can get you better and put you in a spot where you're gonna find a little bit more success and build from there, you know, so it's, you know, there's so much more that goes into this and I, you know, I just think that, you know, to, to, to, to round it out like that, that all of those things matter. And I think it's gonna be highlighted even more in the recruiting process moving forward because we have time and I think it's going to panic a lot of people, which is fine because we've been on a speeding bullet train for 15 years. But it's not going to change anything because you have A lot of programs that are going to get to the end of the season and be like, I don't know what my roster is going to look like when this season ends. I could have my entire team stay. I could have two guys jump in the portal. I could have six. I don't know. And then, you know, kind of assess from there and move on. And that's where, you know, it's going to start. And, you know, it starts with the portal and then moves forward with. With high school guys. So, you know, I don't think the portals. You know, my famous line I think Andy likes to use now is like, you can't commit to the transfer portal. Like, until someone posts on Twitter that they're, you know, blessed to commit to the transfer portal and there's a coach there. It's. You still have to go to college in order to. To enter yourself into the transfer portal. So you still have to be good enough to play baseball. Like, we can't just make the excuse that the portal is ruining every college sport. Like, you still. There's. There's a. You have to be good enough to land there in the first place. [01:27:35] Speaker C: I think the pro. Yeah, I think the process has allowed for the cream to rise to the top. Yeah, I really do. I think it's. You're a high school kid. I mean, like, there are sacrifices that you're gonna have to make if this is what you really want to do. Sacrifices include what you're doing off the field, in your social life, you know, whether it be vacations that you're taking. Like, probably shouldn't take a vacation in the middle of the summer. [01:28:07] Speaker A: Not. [01:28:08] Speaker C: Probably shouldn't. Like, you. You can't like our players when you're. The college. You're not going to take a vacation in the middle of summer ball. You're not going to go play in the. In one of these prestigious college leagues. And then, like, tell your coach, like, during fourth of July, like, hey, I'm gonna go take a week and a half because I'm gonna go on a cruise. Like, no, man. Like, that's not how this works. No. No, sir. Like, you're going and you're staying there. Like, you're gonna have to overcome those things. Like, you need to go through that. But, like, talking about the roster sizes on things, I mean, you're 100, right? I mean, I think 40 was too many. I think at one point, like, during COVID like, because of the grandfather, like, rules in, like, we had, like, 45, 46. It was out of control. Way too many guys couldn't fit everybody in the dugout. And as far as getting guys opportunities like it, yeah, like, you take reps away from guys that practice, and then once you become a head coach, like as an assistant, it's like, yeah, let's bring him in, bring him in. Bring them in. Because you're gonna, you're gonna mask maybe some of the mistakes that you make or you're gonna give yourself a, a safety net for if guys are. Don't produce at the level and that you expect them to and you got some, some other guys, maybe you could step in. But they said, coach, like, I don't want to look in our first team meeting and look out in the group that I'm talking to and say, all. [01:29:31] Speaker A: Right, well. [01:29:34] Speaker C: No matter what, 15 of you are going to be cut because. [01:29:37] Speaker B: We'Ve got. [01:29:40] Speaker C: 49 or 50 guys on our roster. I believe that the fall is, is such a critical time to build your team and build your team culture and your. In your chemistry and, and having guys get to know each other and truly becoming a team. And you can't do that if you've got to cut a third of your roster. It's just not. This isn't pro ball. This isn't, you know, we're not just going to roll the balls out and roll the bats out there and just go play inner squads every day and just pick the, the, the best guys who produce throughout the fall. Like they're. Joe said this to me when I first started coaching, and I thought he was dead on. Like, it. It's your responsibility as a coach, like, to develop. Like, you have to keep that at the forefront of your mind every single day. Like, development has to be such a key factor into this entire equation. Like, yes, winning is important. Yes, Recruiting really good players are going to help you instantly. Like, that's important. No doubt about it. But you can't just give up on a kid because as a freshman, he's doesn't produce at the level that you expect. Like, there's, there's a development process for everybody. Everybody's a little bit different. But if you recruit a kid, it's your responsibility to make it better. And you have to do everything in your power to do that. And if it doesn't work out, it doesn't work out. Sometimes, you know, you make mistakes and things happen, but you can't be making 10, 15 mistakes a year. That's not a good sign. Like if, if kids are leaving your program and just going somewhere. Like, not as good as you of where you're at, well, you're not doing a good enough job in the evaluation process. If kids are leaving and going somewhere better or just as good as where you're at and developing and having a good career, like, if it happens too many times, well, then you've got to evaluate how you're coaching and what you're talking about to these kids and what you're doing with them on a daily basis. Like, there's such a responsibility that we have as coaches to make these kids better. And that's why we're really, we're really detailed in the evaluation process and everything that, that kids say and everything that parents say or, you know, are evaluated. Just like everything that I say during the recruiting process to them is evaluated. But I, I think, I think the rules have helped. I think it's slowed down. I think it's, it's allowed us to make better and more informed decisions. Like, when I go watch a hitter, like, I want to watch him. I want to watch him take 30 at bats over the course of his career. You know, that's gonna. Having a chance to probably watch him play, you know, six times. Five, six times, potentially. You know, if I go watch a kid play five or six times, like, and I know I'm gonna make a really informed decision. Like, I feel really good about the fact that, like, even if he's. Because they're gonna struggle when they get here. So what you have to, what you have to tell yourself is, no, no, this kid is a good player. Because I've seen it with my eyes. I know it's in there. I've got to get it out of them. Versus you take a shot on a kid because you got a video of them and you gave him. You, you took a flyer and it's like, wow, who cares? We, like, we just gave him the fall. Like, get rid of, like, no. I've seen this kid play so many times throughout his, his high school career. I know it's in there. I'm missing something. I gotta pull it out of him. I know, I know he can do it. And it gives you confidence when you're coaching him because that, you know, he's a good player. And that's why the rules have allowed us to slow down and be able to make better informed decisions. On top of the fact that you can't just bring in as many guys as you want. Like, you have to get. You got to set your rosters by December 1st, you know, I mean, we made one roster move this year. And that was because then, that was the day after the fall was over, because the kid wasn't the right fit. Nice kid, good kid, but just wasn't the right fit for our program. And we didn't have to do it, but we did it because it was the best move for our team moving forward. But, I mean, there are a couple kids that probably be better for them to go to a smaller school or maybe go to a junior college because they're underclassmen. But we made a commitment to them, and it's our job to try to pull the. Pull something out of them and make them the best player they can be. And if it doesn't work out a year from now, then I feel good about the fact that we gave him every opportunity that we can. It just didn't. May not have worked out, but when you. When you sit down and you tell a family that you want them to be part of your program, that's such a responsibility on you as a coach to put them in the best position to be successful. And having 50 kids on your roster in the fall is not putting these kids in a position to be successful. It's not putting your best player in a position to be successful because you're cutting reps from them and you're cutting time from them. And the attention that you should be giving with your staff, you know, if your pitching Coach has got 26 bullpens, like, what is that? Like, how are you truly developing relationships with players if you've got to deal with, you know, 24, 25, 26 hitters? Think about that. Like, think about doing individuals that way. Like, that. [01:35:41] Speaker A: That's. [01:35:41] Speaker C: That's not sustainable, and it's not sustainable for. For coaches or the players. So I, I think the. The adjustments that we've made with, you know, some of the recruiting rules has really. Has really helped, for sure. It's not. I mean, nothing's perfect, but it's. It's better than what it was. You know, it's better. Better than offering eighth graders. [01:36:08] Speaker B: Yeah, it's a. It's a huge step in the right direction. And. And it's. You know, I think the rules, they'll change, but I think it's. I think it's in as good of a place as we can get it right now. Yeah. And it'll evolve, obviously. But I think right now, like, you know, I. I actually think it adds some clarity to the recruiting process for a lot of kids, and I want to parlay that into the, The. The closing question Here is like, if you're going to give a piece of advice to a player or parents who are going through the recruiting process right now, like what. What would you say to them? [01:36:45] Speaker C: I would say the first thing is be honest with yourself. That is the first thing. Be honest with where you're at as a player. What do I mean by that? If you run a 7560 and you're shortstop, don't go to Virginia Tech or UVA's baseball camp unless you're just a fan of that place and you just. It's your dream to just go play on that field because you're. They're not going to recruit you. Like, understand what your skill set is. Understanding what is would be the best fit for you. And be honest. You have to be honest with yourself. You cannot compare yourself to other players. Well, so and so is going here and I'm. I feel like I'm better than him, so I should be going here. No, like, everybody's different because every coach is different. Like, your teammate could be a kid that doesn't strike out, can really run, can really handle the bat and really defend. And you could be a hitter who's got a lot of power but has some swing and miss and may not be the best defender. Well, just because your teammate is going and playing Division 1 baseball at this school, that doesn't mean that you fit in with that program's philosophy and how they want to run their offense. Same thing on the pitch inside, right? So don't compare yourself to other people. Be honest with your skill set. And the other thing I would say is have clear objectives and standards for what you're looking for in a school. What do I mean by that? If you're a valedictorian of your high school class and you want to study mechanical engineering, well, you probably should be looking at some high education, some high academic schools, some really, really elite academic schools. If you're going on a visit to William and Mary, you should not be going on a visit to Radford. And that's not a knocker rapper. I. My Radford degree is hanging above my head here. [01:39:08] Speaker B: Right. [01:39:08] Speaker C: I'm proud of it. But I couldn't handle the academic workload of William Mary. Like, if you're looking at Liberty vmi, again, I'm not. And this is not knocking any schools, but like, those are two completely different social and college atmospheres. One is somewhat of a military deal. The other one is very, very much into your religious and, and faith background, which is great. But so many Kids have, like, they're all over the place. I want to go to. I'm gonna go take a visit at vmi. I'm gonna go take a visit at William and Mary. I'm gonna go take a visit at vcu, and then I'm going to go to Bucknell. It's like, what, you got a Patriot League school, you got a military school, you got a school in the middle of the city, right? Like, and then you've got a faith based school. So different sizes, different demographics, different geographies, different areas of the country. Like, narrow down. I want this size school. I want to be in this area. I want to be this close to home. I want to be, you know, this is kind of the cost that I want to be into. This is what I want to study. These are things that are important to me from a baseball standpoint, whatever it may be. Don't choose your school based off of, like, how cool the batting gloves are and how cool the gloves are. Like, that stuff is. Those are artificial feelings that they're gone after one day. Because if you don't, if you don't like the school, the campus, the social life, your teammates, your coaches, you could have the coolest pair of batting gloves in the world. It doesn't matter, because it's going to affect your, your experience in a negative way. Ask the right questions. [01:41:20] Speaker A: Ask. [01:41:23] Speaker C: Ask how. Ask about development. Ask, what does that look like? What are the tools that you use? How do you implement your development Stuff like have baseball conversations. Talk about. Ask about our, the culture of the program. Ask about, you know, the team. What's the team like? You know, would my personality fit in with this locker room? Go to college practices. Pick three or four schools after you evaluate all those things, and then go to their camps. Right? Like, we get it. Like, camps are a way for all programs to financially support, whether it's the coaches, whether it's the program itself. We get it. There's money is the driving force behind a lot of things. But camps are very important when it comes to recruiting. And I think over the last couple years, camps have been used in a negative connotation with a lot of people, whether it be travel, coaches, high school coaches. Don't go there. It's just a money grab. Well, you're investing in your future. So if I'm a good player and I know I can play at whatever level it is, and there's a handful of schools that are similar, and I like, well, now I'm going to go to these, I'm Going to go to Raffert camp, I'm going to go to George Mason camp, I'm going to go to a JMU camp and I want to be around these coaches. Would I, would I mesh well with, with them? Would it, would it be a, would it be a good fit? So only time you have the opportunity to be on the same field as the coaches and the players communicate, talk, ask the players that are working these camp questions about our program. I think you'll be able to get a really good feel and really good insight of what's going on. But if you're a kid from Northern Virginia and you're, you're a backup player on, on the, your high school team and you get an email from the University of Texas, like, and you go to the University of Texas Campbell, that's a money grab. You're feeding into it. Right? [01:43:45] Speaker B: So. [01:43:47] Speaker C: Understand where you're at. Educate yourself on the, on the type of school that you're looking for. [01:43:57] Speaker A: And. [01:43:57] Speaker C: And have those non negotiables for yourself. For what it is that I'm, I'm trying to, I want out of my college experience and the things that I'm trying to accomplish and, and be realistic, Be totally honest and realistic with yourself. Some. There are times that I'll see kids that will come to our camp and I just want to be able to like, I want to give them a refund and be like, look man, like, you can't play in college, like, you shouldn't be here. Right? And everybody goes to these things for different reasons. But if, if you're serious about your, your, your college experience and what you want out of it, then you're going to be honest with yourself. And that'd be the best piece of advice that I would, I'll give these, these families. [01:44:50] Speaker B: Yeah. And I think that that's a, a great way to wrap this up. Like, I think the honesty piece is where it starts because it guides everything else. Right? Figure out where you fit, get, get some good feedback from people, figure out where you fit, and then that helps you make all those other decisions and it starts to paint a picture of like, this is where I belong, this is where I can be, or this is where I strive to go. So what do I need to do now to get there? [01:45:14] Speaker C: So 100% ag. [01:45:18] Speaker B: It's been a pleasure, man. [01:45:20] Speaker C: Been a pleasure, buddy. [01:45:21] Speaker B: We appreciate you guys. Appreciate your time and you know how to reach me. If you're up in Northern. [01:45:28] Speaker C: Yeah, come swing by for sure. [01:45:30] Speaker B: Call us on anybody, but we'll be in touch, man. Obviously, we'll be keeping tabs this spring. Hope you have a happy holiday and you guys get things rolling. I know the guys are off campus now, but coming back soon, so season's right around the corner. [01:45:47] Speaker C: Yeah, buddy. We're excited. We'll definitely stay in touch. Glass, my f. Heather told me to tell your wife. She said hello and that she loves her. [01:45:55] Speaker A: Will do. [01:45:56] Speaker C: Make sure she had you pass out along. [01:45:59] Speaker A: I will. Thanks for coming on, Bob. [01:46:01] Speaker C: Yeah, guys, appreciate you guys have a great holiday. This was awesome. And hopefully we'll. We'll catch up soon and anything you give me a shout, man. Thanks for having me on. This was awesome. [01:46:12] Speaker B: Thanks, A.G. thanks for listening. [01:46:15] Speaker C: Thanks. [01:46:15] Speaker A: See ya. [01:46:17] Speaker B: Thank you for listening this week. If you're watching on YouTube, go ahead and hit that subscribe button and smash that like button for us. Check us out on Apple Podcasts, Google podcasts, as well as Spotify. You can follow us on Twitter and Instagram. If you want to find out what me and Keith do to help families and players navigate the recruiting process, go ahead and check us out on emdbaseball.com take a few minutes to check out our new online academy. I promise you'll get some good information out of that. Thanks again for listening. Check in with you next week.