Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
[00:00:10] Speaker B: Welcome to this week's edition of Dugout Dish podcast. I'm Andy Carrie, tv showed by my wonderful co host. How we doing?
[00:00:18] Speaker C: Great. How are you?
[00:00:19] Speaker B: Good. Got another special guest on.
Gonna kick it over to you for the. The introduction here.
[00:00:25] Speaker C: Sure.
Excited to have our guest tonight. You know, he's somebody who started a program from scratch and has done a really good job developing this program. I believe last year they won the. They won the regular season, which is not necessarily something that you see happening in the span of three or four years of starting a program, but he is mentored by my former boss. I have a very special place in my heart for this young man. But tonight we're joined by Russell Sage head baseball coach Nick Ponteri. Nick, welcome to the podcast.
[00:00:56] Speaker A: I appreciate it. I thank you. Excited to do this. Ready to roll when you guys are.
[00:01:03] Speaker C: Sure.
Before we get going, just give our listeners a rundown of how you have gotten to Sage.
[00:01:11] Speaker B: Sure.
[00:01:11] Speaker A: It's kind of a long, drawn out backstory, so hopefully we don't lose people.
Started my college playing days, and I'll get to the reason why that's important over at Hudson Valley Community College.
Took two years off there after my freshman year. Actually failed out, full disclosure. Halfway through my sophomore year, took two years off. Then Dave Hennessey took the Fulton Montgomery job. So I went back and finished up my junior college ball up at Fulton Montgomery in the spring semester there.
And he took a second chance on me. And that's really where, you know, the love for coaching. I wanted to be a PE teacher, obviously, coach some high school ball that was in, in the, in the front of my mind back then.
But him taking that chance on me through the recruiting process was, was really huge. And then the second chance that he took on me when I didn't necessarily get things right the first time, and he didn't bail on me and stayed with me. And I was recruited to Brockport by Coach Beach, Justin beach, who, you know is probably my, my number one mentor. He's. He's one of the best in the business, in my opinion.
Down to earth guy. He recruited me out to Brockport, had a chance to play for him for two years, and then had a victory lap. That's what I call my fifth year, where I had to do my student teaching and all that stuff. And he kept me on as a student assistant. And with that, I started getting some experience and, and things like that for the recruiting process. So with that, became a graduate assistant in the physical education department, which was a unique experience. I had a chance to teach a bunch of classes, but it also allowed me to keep coaching with Coach beach at Brockport. And that great.
Did that for two years and then they bumped me up to the associate head coach. So I was there, finished my masters, associate head coach there, got a ton more experience. Coach beach had had his daughter at the time, I believe, the year before, so he gave me a ton of experience doing a lot of things. I basically had full control of the pitching staff. He trusted me with a lot of different things. We did a ton of fundraising, a lot of the stuff that are off the field and behind the scenes. I really got a ton of good experience.
He set me up and it's. We'll get to it, but it's part of the reason why finding a good man to go play for is really important. We had had a lot of discussions about, you know, coaching in college and what I needed to do if that was going to be the case. So he would always send me on professional development things to the abca, the World Baseball Classic down in Mohegan sun. And there I had a chance to meet Dan Papicelli, who was the head coach at Cornell.
And just in passing, we had. I had my Brockport stuff on and he had coached at Fischer for years. So, you know, I was a huge fan obviously of him, you know, being the pitching coach from Clemson and obviously the head coach at Cornell and knew exactly who he was, listening to podcasts and things like that. And we just had a really good 30 minute conversation about just different things baseball, non baseball related. And when the time came that summer, his volunteer position opened up and I had had his number, saw that his position opened up, shot him a text and he had said they already filled the position, which was fine. And then something had fallen through and so I basically, you know, reached out again and he had offered me the job for that position. And so I went to Cornell for a year. And then Sage had decided to start a program. And something I probably should have mentioned that I left out is while I was doing my master's at Brockport. So there's a lot of twists here.
My associate, AD Danny Drews, at the time, she was my mentor. She supervised my internship. She was the old athletic director at Russell Sage College. So when that job opened up, I just said, hey, I think I'd be a good fit. And she was like, hey, I think you'd be the perfect fit there. So obviously with her word and her as a reference, I had a chance to work with her for Two, three years. Get really. Get to know her. Connections are everything in this business. So Brockport, Cornell, this opened up, and I've had a chance to start the program, and we've been here for the past five years in June, actually. So this is our fourth year with a team. They gave me a year to recruit, and that's kind of the backstory.
[00:05:33] Speaker C: Yeah, it's awesome. I mean, I think you've been. And usually we talk about this stuff at the start, and I. I'm. People probably get sick of listening to me. Andy. But I'm. I'm so interested in. In people's paths in coaching, because it's not. It's never linear. It's always, like, doing wild stuff to be able to, like, stay in the game as long as you can. But I think the other part that always intrigues me is, like, the people that you get to work with and for. And, like, I.
I don't know, from, like, a younger coach standpoint, like. Like, beach is one of the best that you could work for. I'm not saying that because my wife is the assistant lacrosse coach at Brockport. I'm saying that because I've known Justin for. I'm 38 years old. I've known Justin since I was probably 6 or 7. Like, he's not that much older than me, but old enough that, like, we just missed each other in high school, but we've known each other for so long, and, like, I've. I love Justin Beach. I think he is one of the best baseball coaches in the country. He is stepping down at the end of the year. He is taking an AD job, and the Brockport Golden Eagle baseball team is offered one of the best starts in program history. Andrew. They are 13 and 1 right now, just beating the doors off of everyone. So it's a good start to the last season for Coach beach there, and I couldn't be happier for him. But, you know, Pep's awesome, you know, being able to coach for coach under Pep, too. And then, you know, on your staff, you have my old boss and one of my mentors, Carl Steffen, who, you know, I'm sure we'll talk about this a little bit, but, you know, that guy's won. Officially, he's won 850 games at the college level. Unofficially, it's pushing a thousand because there were a lot of times in the early 80s that they didn't count games that were actually games. But neither here nor there. That guy's won. He's won a ton in college baseball. He's forgotten more than I know about it. And, you know, it's to have him in your dugout, like, you know, I've been there. I know what it's like sometimes. It's maddening. Steph, I love you. It is, but he's really good at what he does.
All right, kick it off. How do you go about finding players to be in your program at Sage?
[00:07:43] Speaker A: Yeah, I think early on, Keith is, you know, it was. And you experienced this. You were at RPI during this time, right? When I first took the job, it was the height of the pand. Okay. So it was unconventional. There wasn't a lot going on face to face, which for a lot of us college coaches, that's what we prefer. We prefer to be at games. We prefer to be in the seats, right in the stands, watching, interacting, listening to what you guys are doing on the field.
But for my first year, it was a lot of video. It was a lot of, you know, this zoom and things along those lines that were basically virtual ways to kind of see young men. And, you know, it definitely worked. We had a chance to recruit not only regionally. Right. But nationally, we got some attention that, you know, we're a brand new program and some, some young men probably turn their heads our way because they were excited for an opportunity of what could be. And you know, basically that virtual process, basically zoom, zoom calls like this. And I would walk around campus and show guys with a cell phone on FaceTime, you know, what certain buildings were, because even visits were restricted at that time.
But to get to more of a conventional, I guess, way and what we do more now that, knock on wood, there. There isn't a full blown pandemic going on.
We love to get out and see kids like I just kind of highlighted and mentioned there, if we're not on the road on a weekend in the summer, something's. Something's going on that's heavy in our personal lives, right? We. We try and get out every single weekend, even during the weeks. We hate sitting in the office at sage. We try and local games that we can go pick up and that could be a perfect game tournament on a Tuesday down the street, or it could be just a, you know, I don't want to say a rec league, but something along those lines, just going and expanding our network, reaching out to high school coaches, club coaches, any contacts that we have basically for. For young men that are just out there playing. So we stay local during the week, we get on the road during the weekends, and we really get out there and try and find anybody we can. In the Northeast region, we hit New York, Pennsylvania, Connecticut, Massachusetts, all the way up to Maine, New Hampshire. We try and hit all those places in a 12 week span over the summer. And on top of that, obviously your section one state championship recruiting. So forget what the original question was, because all that rambling, but that's kind of the location piece behind it.
[00:10:19] Speaker C: No, I think it's good. I think the, you know, generally speaking, every, like everyone who's ever recruited and we asked this question to kick off our podcast for the same reason is that, you know, after 50 plus interviews, like, generally speaking, it's the same type of model, right? Like we're going to get out and see a play in the summer. We're going to get out a little bit during the high school season because we, we're playing too. Like, I can't leave my team on a Wednesday to go watch you pitch on Wednesday because we're playing a game and I need to be there for my players and do this stuff too. And I think sometimes, you know, and I know I ran into this in the, in the Albany area, you know, you'll be, you'll hear all these people be like, well, you know, it's Sages in here, RPI or Union or Skidmore, Albany, Siena. Like, I mean, we're all playing. Like we really only have Monday off. So like that's the only time you're really going to see a lot of us out on the road on Mondays, you know, but you'll see us out all the time in the summer. And you know, I do think it gets, you know, sometimes it gets lost on people that, you know, especially during the high school season, like you're, yeah, we're getting out, but it's more local and it's really only one, maybe two days a week if you're lucky, you know. And I think it depends on your schedule too, right? Like when I was at Siena, we go out all the time because we practice at 1 o'clock, we're done at 3, we're out on the road watching everyone play. Like, I couldn't do that at rpi from a class schedule standpoint. We practice that for like, I can't leave, you know, so it's, it's interesting and I think like, you know, it's, it's. Even though it's the same generally general answer that we get for everyone, like it hammers the point home all the time of like, this is what it looks like from a recruiting standpoint like, we're going to go everywhere, we're going to have camps, we're going to do all this stuff, we'll be at camps. You know, there's multiple opportunities to be able to get in front of us, be able to have us make a decision on, you know, whether or not we think you're going to be a fit into our program, you know, and I think, you know, and I'd be interested because it's.
We haven't had somebody who started a program, right? So, like, I'd be interested to hear your thought process on like, how you've gone about changing your evaluation to guys, like to continually raise the bar inside the program, right? Like that, that first year or two, it's like, yo, we need bodies, we need some, some good players. But like to go from starting a program and in four years winning the regular season, like, that's not necessarily something that is normal, right? Like what, what was the process for you to go from like, yo, we're starting this program and in literally a recruiting cycle, I want to be winning a championship and competing to go into the ncas, which you did. Like, you hosted the tournament. Like, that's a big deal. And I don't think, I think it gets lost on people to realize like, how big of a deal that is and how good of a job you did doing that. But like, what was your process behind that? Of like, okay, how do we raise the bar every year from a recruiting standpoint? And then also, you know, we'll get into the development stuff later. But like, from an evaluation and recruiting standpoint, what was your process there?
[00:13:33] Speaker A: Sure. I think I'm extremely fortunate not only to have the great coaches like you had mentioned, but we've hit on a lot of guys, culture wise. Right.
I think finding guys, we use the term baseball junkie, right? Guys who just eat, sleep, breathe, live baseball. But really it's finding young men nowadays with their priorities in line. And we've been really, really, you know, fortunate to have buy in from our guys that are on our roster and guys that, that we hit on early on in the recru in the first year and our second year, third year. And it just builds on that, right? But the things I think that we look for Keith, and we're kind of chatting a little bit before, you know, you jumped on here.
I can see that a kid throws 86, 87. I could see his breaking ball, I could tell he's got a quick bat, right? I'm not trying to sound cocky. I'm not But I think as coaches, we can see the talent. Right?
But what I really try and look for personally, and again, everybody's going to have different differentiating opinions. I get that.
But I show up to the field, I'm watching how this kid is acting and this is the truth. This is not fluff or some BS answer, right?
I'm watching what happens when he gets to the field. Does he get to the field, hang out, sit there, he's on his phone. He, you know, he's taking Instagram pictures with his buddy next to him. What's he doing as far as dedication to warm up? If I look down and see a guy's doing his bands, plios, he might have some headphones in, like he's locked in. He knows he's, he's, he's dedicated to what's about to come. He's preparing for battle, so to speak. Right. You know, and then what happens during the game, his interaction with his coaches? Does his coach get on him a little bit and does he turn around and throw his hands up? Okay, that's, that's a cross off the list. I don't need a guy that feels like he knows it, all, right? And it's not my way or the highway. That's not the type of coach I am. But you got to be receptive to coaching. Agree with it, disagree with it. Okay? We can go behind the office door and can sit and have a, an adult discussion when you get there. So really fortunate to have guys that are bought into the process, but also just locked in to what they want to do and are excited to play baseball and are there to compete. Right? The competition behind things. Extremely important. Is he in the on deck circle and he's getting his timing or whatever he's supposed to be doing for, you know, his on deck approach there, or is he turned around talking to his three buddies from high school, you know, sitting there chopping it up, laughing, and then walks up to the plate and he doesn't have any idea what the guy's got on the mound. Right? You can tell all of those types of things. And I can sit there and watch that young man do those types of things. Okay. And we try and find guys that are dedicated, that are dead serious about baseball, that are also light hearted and want to have fun doing it too. Fun, right. But the fun comes through the competition and those are things that, that we try and, you know, recruit as far as personality wise. And it's really hard to teach those things when you get to college. It's really hard to ask somebody to care more about something. Right. I don't want to say I'm a believer. You just care. You don't. But you got to have a little want to, you got to have a little intrinsic motivation. And those are the things we look for when I'm out. And that's why I said sitting in the stands is so important to watch a young man play. Right. We do take kids off of video, for sure. There's no doubt about it.
But getting there, seeing him compete, that's, that's really, that's probably the, the biggest thing that stands out. And yeah, we did start the program and we had a bunch of guys come and they decided it wasn't for them after the first year. But you know what? We had a core group of guys that stuck with it, that got punched in the face, that did some punching in the face a little bit to our first year. We had a decent year, made the conference tournament and then we added on top of that with some more guys who wanted, wanted some of that. Who decided that, okay, first year program, they made the conference tournament. A lot of people be happy. Our guys were disappointed with that. They thought we should be playing Fisher in the finals the following weekend. They were upset we lost to Utica and we wanted to try and recruit more guys who fit that mindset and that mentality. And we're fortunate enough to find a couple of really good players in that, in that second year class to build on top of what the guys in the first year had laid the foundation of. And you know, it just kind of builds on itself from there. And then, you know, you got a real good. When the guys are, are preaching what you're preaching and it's not even lip service, it's just their actions. When we bring kids on campus, we've got nine or 10 guys taking BP, you know, like on their own. That's not. Coach led. I didn't tell them to get in there and do that. They're just baseball junkies. They love to do that. There's eight or nine other guys in the weight room lifting at the time. Right. Losing isn't acceptable to them and, and it's not a win loss thing on the field. It's just a way of life. Right. You're going to leave one day, you're going to have to go compete against somebody for a job. Like, so how are you going to make the best you possible?
[00:18:28] Speaker B: I love the, I love what you said. The fun is in the competition. Yeah, I think it's so true. It doesn't matter what level of college baseball you go to play, whether it's Division 1, you're playing in the SEC, or you're playing in a really competitive Division 3 program.
There's expectations that you show up and you compete. There's expectations that you're trying to find out how good you can be at something. And the fun isn't laughs and giggles all the time. The fun is the work. The fun is the process. The fun is going out there, feeling like you're prepared and trying to win, like that's what the fun is. And if you're a high school kid and you don't get fired up, or maybe not even fired up, but like, if you're not excited every time you put on that uniform, College baseball isn't fun in the way of smiles and pats on the butt. It's fun because you love being in an environment where you're going to be tested, you're going to be forced to compete, you're going to be a part of something that's bigger than yourself. And it. I just don't think it matters what level. Like, that is a thing that moves the needle, period. When you have a bunch of guys who want to show up every day, coaching becomes a lot easier. Those kids enjoy being there. They're going to get more out of each other. Yeah. I love the way you put it, because I do. I think that is. That's probably as succinct as you could put it for what college athletics is, is that the fun is the competition.
[00:20:00] Speaker A: Couldn't agree more. Wholeheartedly. But again, you could say all that as a coach. Right. But what do the guys believe? And, and what do the guys do on a daily basis? Right. Do you have, you know, a box of baseballs that, that you have in your, your storage closet? And fall ball ends and then the first day of spring ball. Those same balls haven't even been unwrapped yet. Right. Or do you got guys that are freaking getting after it in the off season, you know, asking for other things, asking for more, asking for this, asking for that. And you got to back them off because of rules. Right.
But what are they doing when. When you're not around? That's the biggest thing.
[00:20:42] Speaker B: Outside of the in person evaluation.
[00:20:44] Speaker A: Right.
[00:20:44] Speaker B: And I think you hit the nail on the head. I think the game, we've moved away from the COVID style where it was like, if you've got really good video and I can make a couple of phone calls, we're probably going to recruit you.
We're back in, we're back into the flow of dead in person evaluation is really important and I think you hit on some really important non baseball things that coaches look for and metrics only get you so far. But like at the end of the day, like we were talking earlier, like if you're 86, but you don't compete, like I'd much rather have the guy who's 83, 84, who competes his butt off because that guy's going to get better, but he has that, that value that you're looking for. How do you tease that outside of what you see in person? Is there, you know, on the visit, Is there certain stuff that you're looking for?
What do you like to see from a communication standpoint, from a player that kind of clues you into, like this.
[00:21:39] Speaker A: Is the right type of kid or everybody's different, right. You have kids that are outgoing, you have kids that are shy.
So finding out first what type kid that is, right. I don't hold any punches on recruiting visits. I mean, I dress like this. I got a hoodie on and probably sweatpants when you're coming to visit, I'm not in, I'm not in a suit and tie. When kids show up because I want them to understand I got 90 minutes, sometimes two hours, right.
For those young men to understand who I am as a person and who they're going to come play for as a person. Right.
You try and give, you know, a little bit with guys, you know, they see each other, walk around on campus and let them talk for a little while without me being there, you know, so they can get understanding of what the team's mindset is. The team's mentality is what the guys really think about me when I'm not standing right there. Right.
But interest is, is really huge for me. I like a young man who knows and who's done his research a little bit on who we are. Right. And mistakes and emails happen, right. You're going to send seven emails and you accidentally call the coach a different name. And that's not what I'm talking about. Right. But it's if you're reaching out to me, talking to me about our engineer degree, you haven't done any research on our school because we don't have engineering. Right? So finding your major, right, Finding that, why it's a good fit for you academically, why you might like the capital of New York, whether that be Albany or Troy, right across the river on our, on our Campus across the river there because we have two.
Tell me a little bit about our program or hey, I followed along your success. Great job last weekend. Those little things, as far as interests are a great spark for young guys in high school. Reaching out to coaches that show just interest at a genuine level, that they've gone and done a little bit of homework about the school. So now I'm like, all right, this kid's dead serious about sage, or at least he wants to be, and he wants to know a little bit more about Sage, and then we can have an honest conversation. Body language is huge during visit is, you know, are guys looking me in the eye? Or if he's a little bit shy, right? Like, you know, what's his body language kind of telling me if he's interested, if we're walking around. And it might just not be for him because he doesn't like the esthetics of campus or something. Guess what? We're not lsu. And that's the first thing I tell kids when we sit down. We sit and talk in my office from anywhere between 10 minutes to an hour, however long it takes, right? And I let these guys know in the recruiting process, right away, I want kids that if I ask, we're going to practice today in the parking lot with a bucket of baseballs and a Fungo. Are you okay with that? Right? And if you are, you're probably the type of guy that I'm going to want in my program, mindset mentality wise. We could talk about all the skill things afterwards, but really, I just like guys who will get it done no matter what. We've been all over the place. We had to drive to Shuttleworth to play our home games last year. An hour away, right? Are you up for that ride? An hour ride to practice every night, three nights a week, just to drive back on Friday and Saturday and play conference games. Like, you got to be dedicated to this if you want to come here. And that's not for everybody, and that's okay. So vetting those types of things out, being honest and upfront, open with them about that as much as we possibly can in the process, and then having them give us their open, honest answers and what they're looking for, right? What do you want out of your college career? How does this unfold for you? How do you see the next four years of your life unfolding? And what do you want, right? Do you want to come to Albany and burn Burn City down for. For every weekend? That's probably not what we're looking For, Right. We like guys who are going to be open to fundraising, we're going to do community service, who are dead serious about their academics, and then who are going to go want to kick some ass on the fucking baseball field. She's my language. I don't know if I can swear here, but I get fired up, passionate thinking about these things, man. And those are the four things that we want. Guys who want to do that. Don't tell me it's so and so's birthday on. On Friday night that you might have to miss practice. No, that's. That's not what this is. Right. I'm not a monster. I understand things pop up and tragedies happen, and there's really terrible situations that young men deal with. But you got to be dedicated to the four things first. And, you know, that's a big part of it.
[00:26:05] Speaker B: I love how.
And I. I can speak to this from a little bit of a personal perspective. Having.
One of our guys was really interested in Sage. He ended up going somewhere else, but he. I remember having a conversation with me and he's like, I really appreciate how honest Coach Ponter is in the conversations that we have. And, like, you put truth to action in terms of, like, what you're saying to everybody who's listening right now. Like, I can tell you this is how you do things. And from a coaching perspective, it's pretty refreshing because there are guys who go through this process and they'll always tell a kid what they want to hear, not what they need to hear. And there can be. Not that they're lies, but there's not always the full truth. And you being able to present yourself like, this is who I am. This is our program. This is what we believe in. If you want to be a part of this, let's rock and roll. But if it's not for you, that's also fine.
I don't know if it's necessarily unique, but it's refreshing to hear you talk about it the way you do because you can tell that it matters to you. You can tell that honest conversation matters to you and that you really want what's best for these kids.
Just being able to ask a kid a question like, where do you see this happening in four years? A lot of kids haven't thought about that.
But to pose that to them, it immediately lets that kid know and the family know that you're more concerned with the kid than anything else and making sure that their experience is going to be of value to them and just more of A kudos to you because I just think it's awesome how you go about your business and I don't think it's any coincidence that you've been able to do what you've done in such short time, because it is, it's real. And now I just appreciate that, having been in your shoes, that, that type of transparency is awesome.
[00:28:01] Speaker A: Working, working, right? And that's, you know, I tailored that question back. It used to like, what do you want to do, you know, in life, right? And then you get some freaked out looks from guys who are, who are 16. And I'm thinking to myself, like, I had no idea when I was 16. Like, I just wanted to play baseball and get after it, right?
And that conversation happens, you know, more as they're with us, you know, hey, what are you thinking about in life, right? Like, you know, we had the conference player of the year last year, Brendan Espinal, and he started his Doctor of Physical therapy school this year. And maybe that's a better posed question for a guy who might be a sophomore, junior seat. But what I've learned is you got to have these things planned out or you got to have a plan A, you got to have something to shoot for, right? And then you find out along the way in college, man, I might not want to do that, right? And you might have to pivot and you got to find something else and that's okay too, right?
But yeah, we've, we've, we've, you got to carefully ask that question because some people, some people get freaked out. They're like, man, I haven't thought about it. Am I behind? Like, no, you're not, not at all. But we do like guys with a little bit of an idea. And if you don't, that's okay too. But hey, just know while you're here, you're going to be thinking about some of these things, right? Because our job is to make sure you walk out of this just like Coach beach did for me. Prepared for life and set up to do something you're going to love for the next 40, 50 years of your life. And that's huge.
We're getting sentimental and deep now.
[00:29:30] Speaker C: I think it's funny because we had, I mean, I had the complete opposite, for the most part, experience when I was at rpi, right? Like, I'd have kids that would reach out and sit in my office and be like, yo, I want to go build spaceships to go into outer space. And I'm like, I, I for one.
[00:29:51] Speaker A: Now you're the freaked out one?
[00:29:53] Speaker C: Yeah, like I hated school and like to have 16 year old, 17 year old kids sit in front of you and be like, yo, I want to build. Like, you know, Chris Grohm, we were talking about him beforehand but you know, he's, he ended up getting his, he finished up at Delaware and got his doctorate. They ended up cutting the funding at rpi, which is why he left. But that's a story for a different day. Like his whole doctorate and this was planned from the time he was like a sophomore in college was to build satellites that could withstand UV rays at a better rate so that they could stay in orbit longer. And like, that was just a fascinating thing to me as a coach to watch because I was like, I remember being 19, like I was way more interested in just playing baseball and you know, doing some other stuff around campus. Not worried about this. You know, I just, I always, I found that, like, I always found that to be so fascinating with my guys at rpi. I remember one day we were, Carl and I were standing there, they were, we were at a rain delay and we were. Greg Echeverria, who was a genius, he was leading a discussion on dark matter in, in space. And Carl and I were like, yo, we got a game to play in like 30 minutes here. Like what are they like? Yeah, but like this is fascinating stuff. I'm like, that's great. You know what else is fascinating? First and third defense that we can't cover right now. Like let's, let's lock in on a couple other things that we might be able to help us win a baseball game. We can discuss dark matter later.
But no, it's, it's so true. I think that like there's the authenticity I think in the, in the recruiting process is, is paramount, I think especially at the Division 3 level. I think it's paramount at every level, but I think especially at the Division 3 level because is no athletic money involved. Like we can't give athletic scholarships. You're really going there because you, you trust in the fact that the, the program and the, and the coach is going to be able to get you to the point where you want to be, to be able to compete at a high level for four or five, six years, right? Like, you know, and you want, you know, and for the people that are listening to this, like that's what you want to look for in the recruiting process. Like I've said this on here before, I would, you know, when kids would come into my office, I would essentially like almost Instantaneously be like, all right, what questions you got for me? And kind of put them on the spot because I wanted to see how you handled that. Like, how prepared are you? Like, how can. Like, who's going to lead this discussion? Is the kid going to lead the discussion? Is it mom and dad? Like, do you forget everything and panic real quick? Or are you kind of like, yeah, I've thought through this, and these are the questions. And, you know, what is the arch program at rpi? And like, kind of those deeper level questions that you look for, not the surface level of like, yo, do you guys go to Florida? Like, right, Yep. Have for a decade. It's on the schedule. Like, what else you got?
[00:32:38] Speaker A: How many different color jerseys do you have?
[00:32:40] Speaker C: Right. You know, so, like, it's, you know, and like, you can discern a lot of information like that as a coach. And I think sometimes not only being able to put kids on the spot, but you, like, you can be authentic about it, too. Of like, hey, this is what, you know, this is what we look for. These are the type of kids we look to bring into our program. This is what it takes to be a student athlete here at X school. And, like, I knew that at rpi, like, you were going to get your butt kicked in the classroom. Like, it is just. There's no if, ands, or buts about it. Like, you have to really love playing baseball because you're going to come out and we're going to get after it, too. We're going to compete. We're going to do a lot of things. I'm going to. I'm going to hold the line on what our standard is. The program that was set by the guys before me and the players before you. Like, there's a certain expectation that needs to be met, and there's only. There's X amount of people who can really do that. And I think that, like, you can discern that obviously in the process, but I think families and kids can really, especially nowadays, like, you can see through it. Kids can see through it just as much, just as easily as we can as coaches see through, like, the fake. The fake competitor. Like, we. They can see through, like, yeah, this guy's not really being that authentic. But it gives you, like, I think it gives you a leg up on people in the process, because it's like, yo, this guy shot me straight, and I have, like, a legit opportunity to go in there and play right away. Like, I might not play right away, but I know I have the opportunity and they're going to coach me up. If I get after it, like, it's on me at that point in time. And I think when you start doing that, like that culture piece that you brought up at the front part, that starts to take care of itself, of like, hey, man, we can have this conversation, but we talked about this in the recruiting process. We talked about this at the end of the fall of your freshman year. Like, here we are. Like, I need you to make the jump. If this is what you like, if you want to get in there and play. Like, everything is out there on the table for you to know what this is. And it makes the decision, I think, for a lot of people a hell of a lot easier to be like, all right, man, I have a real opportunity here. And it's not fluff. It's not made up like this. This is legit stuff. And I think, like, it's.
It's harder and harder, I think, sometimes to come by, but when you find it, you know, right. Like. And, you know, I. I think my. My long winded answer to all this is I. I give you a lot of credit for being able to, you know, be as truthful as you are with a lot of people.
[00:35:06] Speaker A: Appreciate it. I had a chance to sit in a lot of recruiting meetings with, With Coach beach, and one thing he always was, was honest. And he believed in telling the kid straight up, like, this is where I see you. And, and listen, and even at Sage, right, we. We might have lost some. Some pretty talented on the field baseball guys, right? But one thing Coach beach never did, he's never waved on the stance. You know, I'm not promising you 40 stars. I can tell you there's writing on the wall in certain areas, and I think you're a hell of an athlete, right? But you got to come in here and earn and I think, you know, entitled attitude, right? And I think people who.
Deserved is a dangerous word in society, right? People who feel they deserve something, okay? Athletics doesn't guarantee you anything. It doesn't. You can work. And we had a few conversations with some guys, you can work your ass off, right, all week, but that doesn't guarantee you're going to play on Friday. You could do everything we ask as coaches, right? But sometimes a situation might call for somebody else's number, right? But are you still bought into this process? You know, are you still bought into this? We had a kid our second year who started, I think it was 15, 17 games behind the dish as a catcher for us, right? He had a Grad student ahead of us. And I love telling the story and the guys are probably sick of it on our roster because I tell everybody who comes in the first fall meeting this story.
He had, basically we had, we had gotten another catcher. We had, we had found a guy who, who we felt gave us what we were looking for defensively most of the time behind the dish. And so he didn't end up really, you know, getting a ton of playing time at all. I think he had seven or nine at bats officially on, on the year. And we're in the conference tournament and we make a move, we pinch it for the starting catcher, and sure enough, it comes back around in the 11th or the 13th inning, whatever it was. The years all blend in on me now. Push comes to shove, this kid comes up in the situation, right? And I call time and he's walking up to the batter's box, he doesn't have a hit all year. And we've got a runner in scoring position extra innings. And I talked to this kid and he just looks at me dead in the eyes. He goes, I got this coach, right? And I was, what do you say? What do you say? I turned around, all right, he's got this and turned around, walked away and first pitch blew him up. He'll never tell you that. Right when the ball was in the glove.
And then the, and then the second pitch, he hits a single through the, through the five, five hole man. And, and that's a guy who, who didn't really play at all for us. You know, he had gotten some defensive replacement opportunities and he had a few at bats sporadically throughout the year. But he was a guy who was with us our first year and he was bought into the process, right? He cared more about winning, right, and, and competing on game day as a team, not just his personal accolades. 40 starts, 30 starts playing every day. He was down there warming dudes up all game long and then he shows up and he gets the biggest hit. But we tell guys that moment had come five months prior when he decided that he was gonna lock in, do what he needed to do and kept his mental approach for five months. And I'm sure it wavered sometimes, right? But that's, that's why, if you truly ask, that's why we've gotten good so fast. Because we have selfless, selfless guys on our roster that buy into that, that care. And people say, oh, you got to be close knit team. Well, they genuinely care about the success of the team over their own personal successes. And that's that's a huge reason why goosebumps telling that every single time. That'll never change, by the way.
[00:38:48] Speaker B: I think, I think if you've been in this game long enough and if you coach long enough, everybody's got some stories like that of the guy who either kind of started at the back end of the roster and because they did everything the right way, they showed up every day, they were a really good practice player, they were, did all the right stuff off the field, they were a really good teammate, they're, they're engaged from start to finish. Or in your case, guys get told things that they don't want to hear. We've all had to have those conversations of, hey, you think you fit here, but right now this is where you're at and this is why. And in order to get to where you want to go or in order to be a contributor, these are some of the things that we need to work on. We've all had those conversations. But it's funny how the guys who do the right stuff on a day to day basis and don't focus on am I getting what I want and focus on more, am I earning what I should get? It tends to work out for those guys. They either are good in the moment that you talk about or they're the guy that you look to get in at bat to get in to get an inning in a game that, you know, might already kind of be decided and then they parlay that into somebody gets injured and they're ready to go and next thing you know, that guy's a staple in your lineup. I, I, the example I have from, from when I was at William and Mary, we had a young man who came to school as a walk on kind of. We liked him because you could play a bunch of different positions and we needed some versatility.
We needed somebody who could honestly could be a really good practice player for us. And he could basically play five spots. He could play both corner outfield spots and he could play across the infield.
We thought he was an awesome kid. Got to know him really well in the recruiting process. Of course, he ends up being a starting third baseman as a freshman and we recruited over that kid every year.
We couldn't keep him out of the lineup because he just consistently did everything that we asked him to do. He performed when we needed him perform and just his general mentality of being able to show up every day, he enjoyed working hard and the kids who do that, it usually comes out in the wash and it usually is a pretty awesome back end experience and there's different variations to that. But I think what you're driving at is a kids who are willing to do the things that aren't necessarily sexy and flashy and don't always reap the reward right away.
Eventually those guys end up getting rewarded at some point because they do the right things, they're a really good teammate and they're more worried about, well, how do I help us win games versus what is this going to get me?
You hit on a couple things and this is a little bit less recruiting, but you started a program from scratch. Right. And I think that some of the stuff that gets, doesn't get talked about enough and this is specific at the Division 3 level is like fundraising and a lot of the behind the scenes stuff that's really important to running a program.
And how did your experience at Brockport and learning all that, like how were you able to put some of that stuff into play and lay the foundation for what you have now, not just from a player perspective, but like more broadly from a program perspective. I'm probably more curious than from the, than the listeners are, but I think this is kind of the minutiae that's interesting to talk about in these settings.
[00:42:22] Speaker A: Yeah, I think, you know, I think Andy, that goes right back to life, right. And, and you know, when you're 18, 19, 20, you're probably not thinking the, the big picture on why we do these things, right. And like I said, playing for, for beach out at Brockport, he opened us up to 1012 hour days. You know, so a 1012 hour day for me when I graduated college, right. Was just the norm. It was, you know, going above and beyond packing the bus early before we left for the trip. I knew how to do that. Right. I know how to organize that. You know, those little types of things and getting guys to understand that, you know, when you're 18, 19, 20, you might not see the big picture of it. Right. But okay, if the athletic department isn't going to give us money for what we need and they, and I'm not saying they don't, you know, they, they provide us what we need for sure. Right. But if we want to take a nice trip to Florida and if we want new black uniforms with our names on the back and we want a second hack attack, okay, that all costs money. Are you willing to work for it? Right. And that correlates and trying to help them understand that if you don't have something in life when you leave here, are you Going to sit there and complain about it or are you going to get up, get a second job and find a way to make money to, to get what you want, right? Nobody wants to go down and work the Luke Combs concert when all their buddies are going down there having a good time doing whatever college kids do and enjoying the Luke Combs concert. So we had to ask 18, 19, 20 year olds to basically be 22, 23, 24 and, and be adults about situations and hey, present it to them. Hey, you got an opportunity to make money that will directly benefit us this way, okay? But it's a way of life and, and it's the way we want to live our life. We got to have our priorities in line. If we want these nice things, then we have to do what we have to do, right? And that's a cliche slogan. And we tell the guys this all the time. And some of the guys that have been around since the first year laugh at me. But I say grown men do what they have to do in order to do what they want to do. And you know, you could probably them joking around, walking around campus saying it, but it's, it's the God's honest truth. If you want something or you want to go get something, then you got to do what you have to do in order to get that right. And sometimes that, that causes more work. The community. Ask the community service piece of it. I just believe in recruiting good humans. We don't quantify the things we do right, but we try and be active in our community, working with, you know, kids in their high schools, reading the school, working with children with disabilities, things along those lines, bringing youth programs in and you know, working with, I think it was the Gilding Bulldogs last year. They'd come in and used our facility. We had guys show up on Sunday night at 9 o'clock at night to come in and work with kids that are 10, 11, 12 and just give back some of their time in the midst of our season, you know, so they've already got 20 things going on. But hey, here's an opportunity for you to do this with these guys. This, this will be really beneficial. And they don't get anything out of that. They don't get money, they don't get whatever, right? But you know what they do get, get the opportunity to be a good human being. Somebody that's going to look up to them and you might impact their life pretty positively. So we try and throw as many of those situations at our guys as we possibly can and and you know, hopefully they appreciate it five, ten years from now, maybe they might not on Sunday afternoon when it's probably they want to relax. But hey, you're truly making an impact on somebody and maybe they'll grasp that.
[00:45:53] Speaker B: Yeah, I think that we did some community service stuff when I was at William and Mary, and what I found is that the guys really enjoy it. And when you get a bunch of good humans together, it's not a big lift for them to take time out of their day to go to the local community center and play pick up basketball or dodgeball or go to the local elementary school and read to kids.
And I think that's. I got to imagine that has an impact on your culture. Right.
Because there's a team building portion of that as well, that that happens off of the field. And I think it kind of sticks to the theme of being a part of something that's bigger than yourself.
You know, for coaches out there who are listening to this and there are plenty. If you don't do community service and you have an opportunity to. I think it's a really cool thing that the young men and women can give back to the communities that are around their, their schools. And it can be super simple stuff, but I think taking advantage of that opportunity and it's cool to hear that that's kind of a core principle for what you guys do. And I got it. Like I said, I got to imagine that moves the needle from a team building and a culture standpoint for you.
[00:47:03] Speaker A: Yeah, that's, you know, your original question, I believe, was, you know, starting the program. Right. Like, what have I learned there? It's just, you know, basically how to be a. A guy who's just gonna work and go do things and, and not fill up 12 hours of your day just for the sake of filling it up. But how meaningful can you make the hours, you know, while you're doing something and, and there's plenty of time and helping them balance that when they're young is. Is big because they feel overwhelmed nowadays, right. Like they're. It's overwhelming. Some things are over stimulating when you're in certain situations, but helping them and making sure they know that it's all right, you're gonna be fine. You're gonna wake up tomorrow, God willing, right.
You know, and you're gonna be able to. It's. You might have had a rough day, but guess what? Tomorrow's gonna come and you gotta bounce back, right? It's. Life's just gonna keep coming at you no matter what. How you handle it's huge. And that's hard for an 18, 19, 20 year old young man to understand, you know, because it's a lot sometimes, but, but it's not going to get easier. And that's the, you know, that's the. When you got a family, when you got, you know, people to support, when you've got bills to pay, you know, that's, you know, that's where we're trying to build. This is the foundation for it. Right? This is the foundation in college to prepare you for those types of moments. And that's the big picture thing.
[00:48:27] Speaker B: We've had a couple coaches on recently that have hit on that same topic and I think it's a really important one from a coach's perspective and, and for the listeners out there, kind of putting yourself in the shoes of coaches and I think the guys who are really good at this and you're one of them and the guys who really care.
We haven't talked a lot of X's and O's, talked a lot about people and the impact you can have on them. And I think that the coaches who really dive into what they do, they're more concerned with the impact they can have on, on the player as they move through their college career and set them up for success after. Right. And you learn a lot of lessons on the baseball field, for sure. Right. And you know, there's a laundry list of, of different things we could talk about that you learn there around like competition and you know, being a part of a team and dealing with failure and all that. But, but there's so much that a coach can do to help mold a young player into a ultimately like a really good member of society. And I think it gets lost sometimes because, you know, wins and losses are what we play for. Right. And they matter. They, they, they matter like Friday, Saturday, Sunday, like it's win time. But that's a part of the big picture. It's not the, it's not the picture. And I'm glad we've had a chance to kind of hit on some of that stuff because, you know, one of the things that we talk to parents and we talk to players and obviously their, their, their big goal is to get recruited and play college baseball. I think one of the things we try to impress upon them is that the individuals you're around, the coaches that you play for, you got to make sure that you feel like that coach that you're sitting across from on that visit is going to do exactly what you're Talking about, like, when I walk out of here in four years, I'm going to be a better person. It may not always be easy, right? I may have to do some stuff that I don't like. May have to do some stuff that's hard. I may, you know, hear some things that make me think about what I need to do to become a better person, become a better player, become a better student. But in the grand scheme of things, if you make that decision and you find yourself with a coach who really cares about your well being and making sure that you show up on the other end of it on graduation day and a place to go, be a successful member of society, that's kind of what it's all about.
It's hard to quantify that until you've been through it. But, you know, we started this off talking about people, you know, for, for you, it's Coach beach, you know, for Coach, for Glass, it's, you know, guys like Carl and Coach Rossi. And I've, I've had my collection of guys that I've leaned on still talk to today, and guys that I don't talk to, I think the absolute world of. And they probably don't know how much they meant to me in terms of my, you know, personal maturation in the person I am today. But those, those people that you're around, they matter so much. They really do.
[00:51:25] Speaker A: And, and that doesn't go away, right? And, and Keith and I, you know, we, we compete. It was our first year and I'll tell this story and, and hopefully you're comfortable with it, Keith. But they wiped the floor with us on game day, right? You know, that'd be just like 21 nothing or whatever it was. And it was like 17 three and it was just bad. And I'm blowing up. You know, as a first year coach, I'm like imploding in certain instances, exploding sometimes, right? And I'll never forget, man, he grabbed me after the game. He goes, I know it's frustrating. He goes, but you got to keep a level head sometimes or a more level head through certain situations. And I really just appreciated that. 30 seconds of just advice where he grabbed me, put his arm around me, me. He was like, listen, just gave me, you know, some, some behind the scenes advice. And, and that stuck with me. It's like, all right, if the opposing coach can see me doing that, right? Like, what's it look like to guys who are even in my own dugout and I'm still not perfect, you know, and that's What? Steph, man, he helps me out tremendously. Obviously, there's a million things, baseball wise, that he does for our guys, and I'm saying it's just this. But having somebody like Coach Steph in the dugout, he gets me back to normal, you know, and then it gets me fired up sometimes and then, you know, but, you know, having somebody that has been through it over a thousand times in his career and that's just pretty much on the winning side of it, right? Keith, like, he's been through that many games, you know, always get me back to, all right, what do we need to do next? What do you need to tell the guys productively next to help them, you know, instead of just blowing up and it being unproductive. Right.
So I haven't been perfect and having guys in our program that understand that and they've stuck with me through those types of things, you know, I'm not sitting up up here like some angel. I've had a lot of belief in guys that, that have stuck through our program and, and I'm more than thankful and, and hopefully they understand that. But, yeah, there's a lot that goes into this man, and, and having those people in your corner, not only on game day, but in life. And he lives with me when he's up here. Right. So we get to have a lot of serious good life conversations and, you know, when we're not in the heat of things and under fire and in competitive mode, we get a chance to sit back and talk about those things and what we should do moving forward. But my advice to people, the point, I guess, is find people who are going to be like that in your corner, you know, and find people who are going to bring you back to what you need to do in order to make an adjustment to be better next time. And if you have those people, you'll be. You'll be really good.
That's important.
[00:53:56] Speaker C: Yeah, I think it's.
I don't think I can add on to it. It's.
It's wildly important, I think, in this game to understand and respect the guys who have done it for a very long time before you, you know, and I've said this a billion times, like, I came up in this game with guys who had coached forever, and I respect, you know, what they were. They're able to do and what they taught me. And I think that, you know, the game, even though the game changes, it's still at its core, relatively the same. Like, there's certain, there's different ways we're going about doing stuff, and, you know, it's. But these guys have won in so many games, and they've been around so many kids and so many people, and to not draw on their experience, I think is a huge mistake, not only from a playing player standpoint, but from a coaching standpoint, too. Like, you're doing a disservice if you're not, you know, if you're not trying to learn from the guys in front of you. And I also, you know, I. I don't say this. You know, I. I remember that day, and I remember having that conversation with you, and I, like, I'm a believer in. Coach Rossi taught me this. Like, I'm a believer that you want people in this game that are good people and good coaches. Right. And it's like any other walk of life. I'll leave it at that. But, like, I. I didn't.
I know how frustrating it is, and I know what it's like to be in those situations. And I. I saw that you had some talent, and I saw that you had some kids that, like, they really cared, and they were, like, they were trying. And it wasn't necessarily.
I don't. I'm not saying that you. You were missing that point. Like, I. I get it. 100. What you were doing. I just kind of thought, like, damn, dude, like. Like, I wonder if.
If I just say something. And I. I'm glad that you took it the right way. I didn't want to, like, step out of. Out of line, but, like, hey, man, like, you're doing a really good job, you know, And I felt like you kind of had the weight of the world on your shoulders, too. Like, I'm starting this program, and, you know, we're not as good as I would want to be, and, like, there's a whole. There's so much that goes into it, and I, Like, I felt.
I felt the same way that you'd kind of felt probably in the fall. And I had been coaching a lot longer, so, like, I had a lot more experience to draw on, but, like, I felt that same way trying to fill the shoes of Carl. Right? Like, you're taking over for a guy who just won damn near a thousand games. Like, generally speaking and coaching, a lot of people are like, you don't want to follow the guy that was the legend. Like, you know, and it's a. It's a big shadow to try to fill. And, you know, I had felt that way in the fall and kind of earlier in the year where, like, I was Pressing. And, you know, I was coming from a place and I've had this conversation recently where like, like, you know, Ferris had to pull me aside that year and be like, yo, dude, like, you're making everyone nervous, you know, And I, I didn't realize that it was just my. It was what I'd always done, right? But as an assistant, like, not that no one gives a shit, but, like, you know, no one really cares. But when you're the head guy, everyone's eyes are on you. And like, you know, I would move to the end of the dugout by the doors of the shed so that I wouldn't say something or do something that the team would get mad or perceive as being negative. But me doing that was the same thing. And, like, that just didn't dawn on me. And, you know, it was in that moment where, like, you know, having even Farish, who was super young at the time, that, like, to be able to come up to me and say that, like, it changed my perspective on stuff. It changed how I went about doing things. And, you know, don't be wrong. Like, I'm. I'm a. Like, I know people see me sitting at this podcast every week, but, like, like, I'm not a, like, sit down person. I need to move. And like, sitting down for nine innings on a chair and then getting up and coaching third, like, I was like, counting my steps on my watch. I'm like, I need to get more steps in. This is terrible. Like, I'm just sitting in the dugout. This is awful. But, like, it, it brings that calm to what it is that you need to do. And ultimately, like, you know, same thing that you were talking about in the front end, like, the culture and, you know, being selfless and being able to do what's right for the team to win. Like, like, it was, like, it was not good for me to do. To be selfish, essentially, and be like, well, I'm just going to do what I want to do because it wasn't going to make us better in the long run. Like, I needed to swallow my pride, sit there on my bum and be like, yo, it's okay. Even though I was internally wanting to pull and crawl out of my skin, you know, but I thought that, like, in that moment, I just, I watched it and I was like, I think that this kid's really good at what, what he does, but, like, he might lose some of these kids that are legitimately trying. And I've been in that position and I've had people pull me aside and say something and, like, you know, like I said, I'm glad that you took it the right way. I didn't want to, you know, overstep there, but I'm. I'm glad that it's. It's at least resonated for a long time, because I think that it's, you know, we want people in this game who can withstand and be guys like Carl and. And Coach Rossi and all those guys that just coach forever and have great relationships and kids want to play for them. And, you know, it's weird because being on this side of things, I think it's been, you know, with how my career ended and stuff, I think it kind of was viewed in a very weird lens, the way that it kind of went down. And I wish that, you know, as a mea culpa, I guess I wish that I had done it a different way, but at the time, we felt that that was the correct way to do what I did, you know, so if there's any former players listening, I'm sorry.
But, you know, it's. It's just kind of how it played out. And I wish it was a different way. And, you know, I wish that, you know, some of those kids that, you know, were seniors, I wish that I had a little bit of a better relationship now, like I do with a lot of the older guys who, you know, played for me earlier on. But, you know, anyways, listen.
[00:59:55] Speaker A: Yeah, like, listen, man. Like, that's, you know, same thing. Our captain, you know, one of our captains, James Lebanski, you know, he'll catch me, and I. And. And I appreciate it, right? Like, some coaches are like, get the away from me kind of deal, right? But he'll be like, yo, coach, I can see your body language. And I'll be like, yeah, all right, man. I hear you, right? Like, all right. Because sometimes I don't notice it, and sometimes I'm firing. You can tell by the hands moving and things. I wear it on my sleeves, right? Like, it's. It's out here. It's hard to hide, but, you know, having guys that are honest, open. And I asked him at the end of the year, like, what do you need better from me? And there's a lot of it, right? And I wanted honest answers, like, where do we need to go? Right? How do I need to do this to make you guys better? What's going to work for you guys? And just being inquisitive and listening to guys.
[01:00:45] Speaker C: But I think the other thing, too, to your point, like, and Andy Was touching on it earlier with the authenticity part because I did this with my guys too. Like, when you, you're fostering a, an environment where it's to tell the truth and talk things out, which is normal. Where like we grew up in an era where like coach told you to jump and it was just like, yo, how high? Where now? Like, it's a little bit more collaborative and it's. I think it's a little bit harder. But like, when you can, when you can be open and be like, yo, what do you need from me? Like, yo, you need, like, your body language is horrible. Like, okay. Because like, you can't get on them about having piss poor body language. If you're going to have poor body language all the time. Like, it can't be one or the other. Like, you like, and we're not perfect, right? Like, and you know, Andy Heals told me this 2017, 2018 heels. Is that one of our games? And he texted me afterwards and this is like, Andy, like, we played for Dennis Healy. One of my mentors loved the guy. Like, not as nice in delivery on things. He'll texted me during the game and was like, your body language is absolutely pathetic. I was like, okay, well, if he can see it in three innings, probably everyone else in the yard can see this. I should probably try to focus on making the, doing a better job of this. But it made me a better coach for it, you know, And I think that, like, when, you know, I would always do it in games, like, you know, I would get someone thrown out at third. Like, yo, that's on me. My bad, my bad. Like, that one's on me. But like, it allows other people to be like, yo, if I screw up, I'm not going to get blown up. Like, if I can, you know, admit it, move on, like, it makes it better, I think from a culture and a program standpoint. Because it's not like, you know, I'm not going to get blown up every time I do something wrong. It's, you know, coach can admit when he's wrong too. Like, I can probably admit when I'm wrong as well. Like, like, it's okay.
[01:02:47] Speaker A: Like, I know, guys, I missed that one. Right? Like, sorry. Yep, I get it. We'll be better next time. But that, that helps, I think, hopefully, anyways, that helps them take a little responsibility in their actions too. Like when you get rung up by a pitch that you feel is 3 inches off the plate, you know, like, are you gonna sit and cry and complain about it or you're like, yeah, all right, I messed that up. Next time I'm gonna offer at that pitch, I'm sprayed over the dugout or hell, I might hit it over the second baseman's head. Right. Like the accountability piece is, is the big point there. And, and hopefully they, they understand that for sure.
[01:03:21] Speaker C: All right, closing question.
[01:03:23] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:03:24] Speaker C: What advice would you offer up to families and potential student athletes who are going through the process right now?
[01:03:32] Speaker A: Yeah, I think we hit on a lot of it. So not to sound like a broken record, but I'll start with the stuff that, that's obvious to me. Find, find a place and, and not even just a place with buildings or things like that, but find a place with people that are going to genuinely invest in your well being as far as what you're going to do moving forward. Not only in the four years that you're there, Right. But afterwards. Find somebody that genuinely gives a crap about you. And that's hard to tell. Like I said earlier, in two hours, but you've got to try and get as good of a feel as you possibly can for that coach. Right. Two hours on campus, call, text, whatever it is, right. Through communication, try and find out as much about that program, what those guys are like in the locker room, what that school has to offer you academically and how they can set you up moving forward for, for the next X years of life. That's something we preach all the time. Right. There's over 90% rate that people that leave Sage within six months are going to get a job within the degree, the degree they study in. That's a huge part to this thing. They're going to put a lot of hands on, experience on your plate while you're at sage. Right. So a little inadvertent marketing there for, for our, our school, but it's genuinely true. I feel like you've got to look for those types of things. Find coaches that are going to match what you're looking for. Right. We talk a lot about, you know, mentality and wanting the guy that wants to hit the fastball that's 90 miles an hour off the pitcher's head. Not literally for the violence purposes, for the, for the purpose of this show. Right. But that type of mentality, they're not afraid to back away from those people on the mound. Same thing when you know they're on the mouth, they're going to attack, attack, attack. We like the mentality of guys that don't shy away from that. So if that fits you, then look for coaches who Kind of speak like that and hint on things like that during the recruiting process. Right. We are a big mental or approach based teaching. There are things we do individually, right, with different guys and we try and tailor it the best we possibly can for their physical development as far as their swing arm path, etc, things like that.
But approach in the batter's box is, is what we look for. That's something coach Steph is huge on, right? What's your two strike approach? What are you doing if you're leading off an inning? What are you doing if you got two outs with the runner and scoring position? What's your, what's your approach at the plate? We teach more approach based stuff. That's, that's 90% of what we do, right? And then obviously 10, 20% of that is your skill development. Does your swing need to tweak, does your stuff on the mound, your arsenal, does that need to be adjusted things along those lines, right?
But finding what's, what you're gonna develop under best. Some colleges, they're gonna be 90% teaching as far as mechanics and things like that. Are you a guy that needs to be talked to about mechanics every single time you throw a pitch, right? That could be for you. So find out what the coaching style is, how they interact with their players and what they're actually teaching and how their guys are developing in their program.
And those are some of the biggest things I would say look for. But find somebody, do deep dive digging on them, right? Get an understanding who they are, try and find out the authentic them both out of season and in season and then find a place that's really going to help you grow and, and that's a really good fit for you. It doesn't matter. Division one, Division two, Division three channels junior college. Some people take a little bit longer, some people take time off. Everything is okay, right? What's your path and where do you want to go with this thing? And I think, you know, having an understanding of what you want to do and then setting a plan and going to do it and then having a plan B if it doesn't work out, right. But pushing through things, staying with it. Nowadays people look to transfer a lot because that first fit, they don't do it enough justice or whatever it might be. As far as looking at their, you know, schools, they're, they're trying to find, don't make impulse decisions, really take the time to do it. There is no rush. Instagram means nothing. When you put your post out there, I promise you it is exciting. For everybody. It'll be just as exciting in, you know, March, April, May of your senior year. If you so choose to wait that long, then it will be, you know, in your junior year. I promise you, there's no rush. Find the right fit for you, and you'll be good to go.
[01:08:03] Speaker B: Well said. I mean, I think kind of the theme of this podcast has been people, right? And I think you nailed it there. You got to find good people that you're going to play for and people that you're going to be around, and that has to be a big portion of what you're looking for. Whether you're, you know, the most highly recruited guy in the country or you're a guy who's choosing between one or two different schools. Like, make sure that you're walking into a situation where you feel that that coach and staff is not only going to make you a better baseball player, but you connect with them on a personal level, and you feel like that that person's going to get the most out of you in the long term.
[01:08:41] Speaker A: Absolutely. Ask Coach beach how many times I call him a week.
And I played for him 15 years ago or 13 years ago now. Right. Like, you know, I trust them, you know, and. And that's a big reason why I went there. You know, it's huge.
[01:08:56] Speaker B: Well, Nick, really appreciate your time in awesome conversation.
Anybody who gets to play for you is lucky you. You pulled at some of my heartstrings with. With how passionate you are about this and how important.
Having an impact on. On the individualists and. And yeah, Sage is in good hands, man. Obviously, wish you guys the best of luck the rest of the season. See if you can't not only get yourself a regular season, Chip, but find yourself in that regional, it'd be awesome.
[01:09:28] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. I appreciate that. And just for, you know, listeners or, you know, even potential people looking, you know, Keith, what you guys are doing is. Is amazing. And I can say this genuinely because you've called me on kids and, you know, you've given me the honest upfront about what you know about them as human beings, and then, of course, what they. Who they are as. As. As athletes as well, you're in great hands because there are a lot of people out there who. Who, you know, promote kids and. And I don't want to say I disagree with it, and I don't want to speak on the negatives of the recruiting aspect, but, you know, this guy's got you guys in good hands and they're doing things the right way. And when they call, that's definitely a phone call we answer. Or if they text, it's a text we definitely get back to for sure because we know they've got your best interest in mind and it's not just some bill of goods they're trying to sell us. So appreciate you guys, too, for doing everything that you guys do and. And being first class about everything.
[01:10:25] Speaker C: Thank you. Appreciate that.
[01:10:29] Speaker A: All right, enough of the. Enough of the compliments.
[01:10:33] Speaker B: Well, thanks again, man.
[01:10:34] Speaker A: Thanks again.
[01:10:35] Speaker B: Yeah. Awesome to have you. We'll be keeping tabs and we'll be in touch soon. Thank you everybody for listening. Catch in with us. Check in with us next week.
Thank you for listening this week. If you're watching on YouTube, go ahead and hit that subscribe button and smash that like button for us. Check us out on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, as well as Spotify. You can follow us on Twitter and Instagram MD Baseball. If you want to find out what me and Keith do to help families and players navigate the recruiting process, go ahead and check us out on emdbaseball.com take a few minutes to check out our new online academy. I promise you'll get some good information out of that. Thanks again for listening. Check in with you next week.
